ToEE World Builder v1.7.5

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

Well, whatever floats your boat, you know.
If you asked my opinion, I'd say - use both of them, depending on what you want to do, really. Here's a comparison of what each of them is good at:

ToEE World Builder's Prototype Editor:

- A nice, easy interface to edit a single prototype at a time
- Ability to use IntelliProperties to fill various fields faster
- An easy ability to derive new prototypes from existing prototypes, together with adding a description, which is really cool when you are working on a mod and need to work on protos and MOBs at the same time (no need to switch back and forth from ToEEWB to ProtoEd and vice-versa and reload protos to ToEEWB all the time)
- Ability to synchronously modify descriptions and long descriptions for prototypes
- More fields known, and easy way to add new ones if you learn something

ProtoEd:

- A nice Excel-style gridlike representation of the whole file at the same time (could be good sometimes, like if you want to compare your changes with other prototypes, but could be bad too since can get confusing if all you want to do is edit a single prototype). Everything depends on what you want to do.
- Ability to operate with bigger chunks of data, moving, cutting, pasting, etc. things (could come in handy if you're merging or splitting data, just as you said)

I'd like to say that the ProtoEd was originally meant as a standalone tool, and that's what it's good at (i.e. deep-editing protos.tab, possibly a lot of entries at the same time). ToEEWB's prototype editor was originally meant to be used as a supplementary tool that works with other facilities of the World Builder, and mainly with the mobile/static object editor. It's just a different paradigm (in ProtoEd, you seem to create prototypes as standalone entities - just because there was no possibility of mob-spawning objects back in the days when it was written, and that's why the tool is so detailed to allow viewing multiple similar entities at the same time (just my opinion though, don't take it for granted); in ToEEWB, you create prototypes that are later transformed and spawned via mobile/static object subsystem, and that's why I thought a facility that would allow you to derive and modify a single prototype from another prototype in just a few clicks would come in handy, so you won't have to work with the whole table complications of ProtoEd just to do the above-mentioned thing). I'd really love to see ProtoEd updated now (to include all the newly researched fields and stuff), but unfortunately it seems to be a dead project.

As for your phrase "ToEEWB protos editor is missing some features", I can tell you that it's not missing anything - it has exactly what it's supposed to have. It's simply not what you thought it to be, it's just a little different tool for a little different tasks

So, as I said, use whatever fits your current task and your current level of understanding things. Personally I use both (but ToEEWB more often since it really feels better once you get a good grip on how things work in protos, and if you're supposed to work with one prototype at a time)

Don't take anything in this thread personally. Newcomer modders are extremely welcome here at Co8, so good luck in your modding!! Feel free to ask any questions, ToEEWB/ProtoEd-related or not

- Agetian

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

I've got my maps up and running again, I want to make a busy city street, I have copied protos entries for nulb vilage man and woman and I want them to wander around.

How do I make them wander? to I have to assign jumppoints to them? I asigned the wanders tag to NPC flags in the prototypes and checked the wander and wanders at night boxes in the mob and set his speed to 1. Still no walking guy!

Help please?

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

The ONF_WANDERS_* boxes seem to work only in collaboration with a highly complicated waypoint/standpoint structure that is not completely broken down yet. Therefore, using those switches will have no effect for now (if I'm right). If you want to make a creature wander, use the way Livonya used for Kent and the village kids (check her script py00228kids_off.py to learn how she did it - it's pretty much assigning random jumppoints at different time, it's not too complicated to learn how it's done).
Hope this helped.

- Agetian

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

Allyx -

I suggested this to Liv way back when her mod was first in development (regarding the kids) -- you might want to consider just having the people stationary anyway. It sounds like it would be easier, and when you think about it, not everybody is walking around all the time in RL. I had thought a few people standing around outside the welcome Wench would be cool, that sort of thing. Maybe just a few of them should wander. Just a thought. Your mod your call.

btw, what you're up to sounds really cool. Glad you're on the case, my man!

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

Thanks man, I appreciate that.

I had a horrible thought today while modding, I deleted the .mobs (I'll make mine from scratch) but about door icons? since they're embedded into the .sec files (I didn't want to have to delete those), they dictate where the walls are!

But lo and behold I can extract the icon's as a .mob edit it and re-embed it back into the .sec, NICE WORK Agetian.

(one small suggestion though, could you make ToEEWB check If there is a .mob already in the mobiles folder and rename it if a duplicate file name is there? I had an unhandled exception when I tried to extract a second icon because it tried to save it as a mob with the same name as one that was already there).

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

<sigh> I've just spent about 5 hours trying to make kids wander around the labourers camp... why didn't I just come online??? :yawn:

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.1

Hey,
It's being worked upon, though I never had an unhandled exception because of that (for me it just overwrites the old mob file, which is no better though)... It's kind of hard to implement since the GUIDs are not only external (e.g. in the file names) but also internal (they are stored in the file structure)... I'll try to implement it correctly, but it'll take some time (I really want to avoid inserting more bugs)

- Agetian

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

Version 1.2 is out! It's a bugfix release, it has no new features but it includes all bugfixes that were previously released as hot updates to v1.1, plus it fixes the static object extraction behavior (hey Allyx, do you hear this? ) so that it prompts to overwrite the previous MOB file if it already exists (with the same GUID).

- Agetian

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

Thanks Agetian.

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

I tried adding a secret ladder with a search DC of 20, on the secret doors tab I checked the second box down set the DC to 20, checked the box for flags and then the one for secret doors (already had the jump points) and embedded it. Put the .sec files in the map folder, but when testing it say's the DC is 0, what did I do wrong?

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

Strange... hold on, I'll see what's wrong with it OK?
In the meanwhile, try extracting an existing secret door and see how it's defined, OK?
- Agetian

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

Strange, I'm not sure if you have done anything wrong, but there is definitely no problem with ToEEWB here. I'm not sure if this is of any significance, but original secret doors also have the "Object Name" property assigned to it, with value 1602 (I'm not sure if it can somehow affect the gameplay though). I checked some original secret doors and they are defined in exactly the same way as you did... strange it shows up as DC 0. By the way, how do I check the secret door DC in the game?...

As for ToEEWB, it reads and writes back these properties perfectly, so there shouldn't be any error here... Maybe it's some in-game bug?... Anyway, hold on while I search for extra clues...

EDIT: Seems that the obj_f_secretdoor_dc value is very volatile in the game, it may change to a variety values, including 0 and 65358, and I don't know if it's a bug in the game or if it's supposed to be like that. I created two secret doors, one with DC 15 and other with DC 25, for the first time when I played the game the first one was detectable by take 20 while the second one wasn't (Search=0). The other time both doors were detected for some reason. Maybe the DC thing is bugged in ToEE?

Anyway, let me know if you find something out.
- Agetian

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

when you enter the room, if you pass a seach check (roll made automatically) the text "secret door detected" floats up in blue text near the door and the icon fades in. open the rolls tab (with the D20 pic on it, in the bottom right corner of the screen) it says "@pcname@ attempts search" and under neath in blue text again say's "success" click the blue success link to get the roll breakdown it say's

+11 initial (search skill ranks)
+4 Inteligence bonus
+1 racial (he's half elven)

Roll (result on D20) +16 (total of bonus') Vs DC0 SUCCESS

 

Re: ToEE World Builder v1.2

Weird, just tested it, the 'roll history' window is completely empty for me after I search (even if I detect things), I'm not sure how to make it show my search roll!

Anyway, try fiddling with OSDF_SECRET_DOOR_DC_* flags and see if it makes it any different (I doubt it though since I haven't seen a single secret door in the game that would make use of that).

EDIT: Just retried it yet again and this time it showed me the roll history correctly. It said .... vs DC 15, just as it was supposed to be. No DC 0 there...

- Agetian