Starting out...too hard?

Well it takes 17 levels to get level 9 spells if pure, so taking other classes is going to leave you behind for at least* 90% of the game. IMO the benefits are just not big enough to justify that gimping of your casting abilities.

* Because there are 20 levels doesn't mean that you will, or have to, get there. It could easily be all game.

 

oh well, I never made enough XP to reach that level anyway... best I reached (even with Verbobonc etc) was lvl 14/15, I do not grind and had a full party.
Also imo the access to better equipment is worth the 1 level (for a cleric, also don't forget the bonus feats you get when taking fighter levels) and since I always have a wizard and a sorcerer, taking 2 lvl of rogue for your wizard is hardly a handycap and saves you the party slot for the rogue. Are there any worthwhile high level spells? I'm asking because the only good spells for the druid above lvl5 spells were the monster summoning spells (but I don't think I had lvl7 spells on her...)

 

I'll be honest I don't know what's available in game, as I only played before the level cap was removed. But yes there are some very good 9th level spells available, such as Wish, Timestop, Bigby's Crushing Hand, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Imprisonment.

Also at level 15 your Sorceror can't even cast level 8 spells, and your Rogue 2/Wizard 13 can't either, so it's not done you much good to have both.

As far as Clerics are concerned I can't see that 1 extra Feat does much for him. Without PrCs, and with limited Feats available, you'll be struggling to find something decent to take if you started with Human (probably the best take). And the same goes for Cleric as Mage - at level 9 you have Mass Heal, Implosion, Miracle.

 

I was talking about ToEE not about DnD in general. These spells are available in ToEE? I doubt it.
And even generally speaking, the weapon and tower shield prof from 1 lvl of fighter + the additional feat are worthwhile for a cleric.

 

Damn, you really know the system inside and out

I've been a way a while, just noticed a new mod, I think I might make a new party. I'm not sure what to make yet though.

 

Is there a list somewhere?
I just noticed druid spells lvl6 were only mass bears endurance and stuff like this, sure the Dire Bear from the summoning spell is very powerful but other than that I wasn't too excited (about the druid spells, arcane had a bit more choice)

 

1. never, ever, ever sacrifice spell progression. Cardinal rule of D&D. You do not multi class out of your spell casters.
2. Direct damage sucks, a lot. You can decimate the enemies with the right spells.
3. Casters should start with at least 18 in primary casting ability. all else is secondary.
4. have a strategy (hit things is not a strategy)
5. Healing in combat is usually a waste of an action (with some exceptions), it is often better to kill the enemy faster instead... (sometimes combat healing is necessary)...
6. Improved initiative is +4 to initiative rolls, it is a really really good feat, everyone should have it.
7. Don't play the game with under 5 party members, just... don't.
8. All spell casters moonlight as archers / crossbowmen.
9. You need 2 or 3 tanks in your party of 5... 1 main tank, like a fighter, 1 cleric, or a druid can work too... a third tank will make things easier, but for an expert you can play without it (ex, current playthrough is wizard, cleric, fighter (greatsword), rogue elf (longbow), and a bard who has a longbow but is specialized to be a talked, maxed out every pertinent conversation skill).
10. Elves make excellent rogues, terrible wizards.
11. Humans make excellent everything, except rogues which elves do better.
12. The spells mage armor and shield are traps... you should not be wasting your level one spells on those... your wizard should stay in the back, and AC14 vs 10 is not gonna make a difference... a grease spell and enlarge person can be HUGE battle tide turners... and if you meet something not immune to sleep, sleep then coup de grace them, it is a level 1 "save of die" spell... because anyone asleep might as well be dead... known as "save or lose"
13. Save or die spells usually are not as good as "save or lose" spells. an unconscious / helpless creature is just as dead as a dead one, you can slaughter it at your leisure. But "save or die" spells are easier to resist... for example baleful polymorph, enemies get a +4 to resist it if you are polymorphing them into an animal the can't survive current environment, like a fish out of water (they will choke)... but why bother? polymorph them into a "newborn puppy"... they can't walk or see for 2 weeks, you cant miss them, and their HP is like 1 at best... and the spell is permanent... so you avoid the +4, and while they don't die, you can kill them at your leisure... (for bonus points, if they fail a second save a day later they will lose their memory and human intelligence and will become essentially a real puppy).
14. Tashas laughter is really really powerful... makes short work of the giant...
15. A weapon in each hand (double sword and other such double weapons are considered a weapon in each hand... although staff can be used single handedly or double handed, your choice) sucks in DnD. unless used in a highly specialized build by an expert (even then it has its limitation), a single handed weapon + shield is big meh. and a two handed weapon just dominate.
good two handed weapons are:
1. Greatsword, 2d6 damage 19-20 crit 2x slashing
2. Greathammer 1d12 damage 20 crit 3x crushing
3. Greataxe 1d12 damage 20 crit 3x slashing
The greatsword does the most damage (a die cannot roll a 1, so a d6 averages a 3.5), and averages the most crit damage over time, but the crits are less spectacular... that being said, the really dangerous things are all immune to crits.

Anyways two handed weapons have the following benefits:
1. Excellent damage
2. Damage improves to 3d6 when enlarged (by enlarge person).
3. power attack converts each attack points to TWO damage points (1 to 1 conversion in smaller weapons)
4. add 1.5x your str modifier to damage instead of just your str modifier.

All those add up to you doing tons and tons of damage with a two handed greatsword, sure your AC is a bit lower but you are slaughtering the enemies... take an 18 str fighter, hit him with +4 str bulls strength, and an enlarge...
He is now str 24, or +7. He does 3d6 +10 damage per hit, and he has reach, can power attack well, and you better have built him to have cleave and combat reflexes (extra attacks of opportunity)...
Now either equip that monster with a ring of freedom of movement, or a vest of escape, you are now immune to web (oddly enough it does not work with grease)...
One of those standing in the middle of the hallway, attack of opportunitying anyone who comes by, attacks of opportunity as they break free from web, attack of opportunity as they get up after falling from the grease, and cleave attacks... and you are doing ~20 damage per hit with an unenchanted unbuffed sword (and naturally you can throw other buffs out there like bard inspire courage, cleric bless, etc). Don't forget good old haste at level 3, gives one extra attack at full attack bonus per full attack...
Speaking of, use full attack. If you click on someone, you will either do a standard or full attack, depending on your remaining move... thing is, you are wasting attacks if you down it in one (once you are high enough level to have multiple attacks per round that is)... using a full attack you can individually decide who to hit with each attack... (you hit, do cleaves, then you get to chose who to hit with next attack, and so on until you run out; this prevents you from wasting your attack on a dying opponent)

Let me give you an example on how to fight those terrible deklo grove spiders (which are a very tough encounter for a level 1 party and I don't recommend until at least level 2 or 3; a group of human bandits are much easier... those are giant MAGIC spiders that cast web at you... web is a spell level 3 spell, that means only a caster level 5+ wizard / cleric can cast it)
Anyways, you want to use grease to max effect, grease them to make em fall down, spread out the party, then have your tanks slam into them from all directions. You are getting attacks of opportunity as they get up, they lose turns due to failing their saves and tripping, the AC takes penalties when prone, you have a bunch of your guys attacking them, and they are not attacking back... a cleric of the god of roads get free freedom of movement for its level turns... so that can also help... but it is a really tough encounter and you will need some luck.

Also, never bother breaking free from a web, not worth the effort. just cast a spell / shoot an arrow from within the web (hopefully you are never webbed yourself though...) you can instantly destroy the web with fire, dealing damage to everyone... freedom of movement means you ignore it.