Standardizing Scrolls, Potions, and Wands

Discussion in 'General Modification' started by Gaear, Jun 19, 2008.

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  1. wizgeorge

    wizgeorge Prophet of Wizardy

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    On a seperate note, why would a wizard keep a powerful wand in a chest when he is charged with defending the Orb. He should have it equipped and use it, along with fireball. The Smigmail/Falrinth encounter could be made a lot tougher with a little modding. The Orb is a major factor in the game but isn't fully developed. Lot's of possibilities.
     
    wizgeorge, Jun 24, 2008
    #31
  2. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    I don't know the answer to that, only that there are protos fields that assign values to identified and unidentified item descriptions. :shrug:

    I'm not so worried about people consoling in illegal wands, btw; moreso that they'll be available for crafting during normal play, which would be a flagrant exploit for people who aren't console wizards and just want to play an honest game. Which is what I've understood to be Co8's objective from the outset. I also see some merit in keeping a clean house, as these files are used and modded by mutiple modders, not just an individual who can be as neat or messy as he feels comfortable with.

    Re: the console, it's functionality was built into Atari patch 2 rather discreetly, with a wink and a nod from Troika in our direction (through zhuge and the Co8 beta testers of Atari patch 2) and no public announcement that it was a new feature. I take this to mean that it was basically a testing/development gift from Troika to us, since they knew we'd be carrying the ToEE torch. I don't suppose it's use for normal players was ever really intended, and in that sense the people who peddle the 'open the console and type x to achieve unintended result y' messages aren't really doing anyone - players or developers - any favors.
     
    Gaear, Jun 24, 2008
    #32
  3. Greylan

    Greylan Established Member

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    I'm not even sure why that wand was there. Removing it would seem to be faithful to both the rules AND the pnp module -- I just read the entire entry for Falrinth and his lair, and there was no wand of chain lightning. There was a wand of wonder though.

    A lot of the stuff in protos.tab (like excalibur, etc) is still faithful to the 3.5 rules. It may not be able to be created by characters of level 10, but they're still faithful to the rules. However, it is of course good that they don't show up as treasure in the game. :D
     
    Greylan, Jun 25, 2008
    #33
  4. wizgeorge

    wizgeorge Prophet of Wizardy

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    I think a lot of the stuff, tho not available in-game or craftable, were for "future" use. Ala,ToEE2, etc, that never happened. There wasn't going to be a toolset so the console was some help. Had ToEE been a big hit, then it would be a different story. Alas, what could have been.
     
    wizgeorge, Jun 25, 2008
    #34
  5. Cuchulainn

    Cuchulainn Windmill Tilter

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    Aparently I never actualy posted the files. I'll include the urn with the menu stuff when I finish that off.

    Cuchulainn.
     
    Cuchulainn, Jun 25, 2008
    #35
  6. Shiningted

    Shiningted I changed this damn title, finally! Administrator

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    Thanks Cuchulainn :thumbsup:

    So we're disabling the console? Please say yes :yes:

    EDIT: Sorry, lost my first reply and forgot to answer the Identify thing in my second: col 55 in protos.tab points to the 'unknown' names in description.mes, the 20000's, which covers everything from 'magic sword' to 'drunk'. Once an item is identified, the item will be described according to the description.mes number refered to at col 23, or 'ID#' as ProtoEd calls it. If there is nothing in col 55 (most items) then you don't have to worry about it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2008
    Shiningted, Jun 25, 2008
    #36
  7. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    If we disbaled the console we'd no doubt get dozens of "I started a new game and tried to console in my usual starting equipment - answering swords, magic plate mail +700, boots of sasquatch strength, etc. - but the damn thing won't open! What the hell is wrong with you people?!" complaints. ;)
     
    Gaear, Jun 25, 2008
    #37
  8. wizgeorge

    wizgeorge Prophet of Wizardy

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    Startequip.mes is editable with notepad but Invensource is not, so there are things available if the console isn't. About the only time the console is really useful is game.fade when the party is way down on hp and a random with 4 trolls will kill everyone. The welcome wench inn sure looks good right about then.
     
    wizgeorge, Jun 25, 2008
    #38
  9. Cuchulainn

    Cuchulainn Windmill Tilter

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    Thanks Ted. I did actually know that, but the game must keep track of IF an item has been identified to know which description to dislplay. I was hoping if we knew how it kept track we could pull of icon switching once a potion is identified. For example all potions start out as sickly green (or whatever) but once identified display an icon unique to school, or even potency since it's identified at that point.

    Or antoher possible technique can we tell via script when Identify is cast on an object. I've never even looked at the scripting for this engine, but something along the lines of

    Code:
    IF IsIdentifyEffectPresent == 1
     remove item GenericHealPotion5
     add item IddHealPotion5
ENDIF
    Would require a lot of work as there would have to be a duplicate of every potion in the game, so probably not worth it.

    Cuchulainn.
     
    Cuchulainn, Jun 25, 2008
    #39
  10. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    Just a heads-up ... the final implementation of this is that the illegal wands will stay in protos.tab anyway. I had issues with launching after removing them, not surprisingly I guess.

    I'm interested in Cuch's idea about changing icons, particularly in the case of potions. Right now the majority of potions are from the transmutation school, which is grey. So they don't look very exciting. If we could make unidentified things grey (maybe change transmutation to dark green or something like that), then they could change from grey and unexciting and unidentified to colored and identified (and exciting).

    If we limited this to potions it wouldn't involve that much work, as there aren't that many of them.
     
    Gaear, Jun 26, 2008
    #40
  11. Shiningted

    Shiningted I changed this damn title, finally! Administrator

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    You can replace stuff in protos.tab, but not delete stuff that has a mob somewhere in the game. I mention that in my tutorials - sheesh, theres only 200 pages or so, don't u have them memorised? :p

    Cuch - sorry, misunderstood. That one is even easier: there is an OIF_IDENTIFIED flag that the game keeps track of, and we can keep track of too :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2008
    Shiningted, Jun 27, 2008
    #41
  12. Sitra Achara

    Sitra Achara Senior Member

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    Doesn't the item_creation.mes file determine which files are craftable and which aren't? In this case, there's no reason to delete anything from the protos.tab (not to mention it makes the game crash)

    Also, I'm opposed to the removal of the chain lightning wand from the game. Why? Because I like it. Taking the RAW stance is fine and well, but often you have to balance it with other considerations, such as ToEE being based on a 1st Ed module, gameplay concerns, the "fun factor", and others.

    I wouldn't mind if it weren't craftable, though.
     
    Sitra Achara, Jun 29, 2008
    #42
  13. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    Some of you guys are getting waaay too wound up about this. This thread never contained a compaign to remove the wand of chain lightning from the game. That would have been an incidental consequence of removing illegal wands from the game, which itself was a consequence of discovering they were there in the first place due to the whole 'colors of schools' business, which was the original thrust of this thread. Now that I've discovered that removing those wands crashes the game and have stated that they won't be removed, this should no longer be an issue. It will only contiinue to be an issue if it gets pushed too much and I become inspired to go RAW on everything (which is indeed part and parcel of Co8's original mission statement).

    Moral of the story: if you dearly love the wand of chain lightning and want it to remain, the best strategy to achieve this end is to not say anything about it here.

    Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2008
    Gaear, Jun 30, 2008
    #43
  14. Shiningted

    Shiningted I changed this damn title, finally! Administrator

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    Sorry to ask what might ultimately prove to be a really dumb question, but do we have 'Craft Staves' in the game?

    (Lemme rephrase that: do we currently have 'Craft Staves' as a usable, working option in ToEE?)
     
    Shiningted, Jul 5, 2008
    #44
  15. Allyx

    Allyx Master Crafter Global Moderator Supporter

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    Yes Ted, Craft Staves is in game, and works for creating staves that have their own proto all ready with spells ect assigned (the staff of healing, staves of fire and ice, woodlands etc... there is a pretty good list, but by no means covers all the possibilities for staves that PnP would offer, just the ones that could be supported by the game from the DMG in terms of available spells and abilities etc...

    Craft rings is also working and likewise all possible rings from the DMG was added to the list. Geez that mod was out while Liv was still making her v1.5 :doh:
     
    Allyx, Jul 5, 2008
    #45
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