Going To Move Some Secret Doors and Stairs

Discussion in 'General Modification' started by Gaear, Jul 11, 2008.

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  1. thearioch

    thearioch Need More Cowbell

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    But he also said:
    So, Ted, can I count on your vote to remove the secret door? :)

    There's always the console for cheaters... :wave:

    (or, as I like to call it, the DM Interface) :)

    --thearioch
     
    thearioch, Jul 13, 2008
    #16
  2. Shiningted

    Shiningted I changed this damn title, finally! Administrator

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    Yeah thanks Arioch. I am quite aware some of the suggestions I am making are not consistent, but then they are not all meant to be simultaneously implemented. I am trying to find a compromise here.
     
    Shiningted, Jul 13, 2008
    #17
  3. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    @thearioch -

    The dire rats are not a factor, only the giant snake. The rats are docile unless you do something to agitate them. I think it thus boils down to you going up against the bandits to get to the secret stairs or going up against the snake.

    I don't think that the change is significant in the gameplay sense, only in an aesthetic one. People who explore (and meta-gamers) will find the bandits anyway, just as people always found the snake (or so I assume). Meanwhile, all would seem right with the world because the secret staircase wouldn't transport you into the fourth dimension. ;)

    [edit after re-reading your question]

    I'm not sure where the bandits are coming into your equation. If you enter via the main door, you could go straight to the stairs and never see the bandits at all (though you'd have to see the snake), so there would be no need to 'sneak by them.' If you entered via the secret door, you'd be right on top of them as usual, and there would be no chance to sneak, as usual. Only then, instead of taking the secret stairs straight down, you'd still have to go over past the snake.

    All still essentially irrelevent gameplay-wise, imo.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2008
    Gaear, Jul 13, 2008
    #18
  4. thearioch

    thearioch Need More Cowbell

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    Ted -- I used smileys, I wasn't trying to bust your balls.

    @ Gaear

    My last post to you was just trying to enumerate what we trade off by using the stairs as printed in PnP (and implemented by Troika) v. making the maps look "right.". I personally would prefer the map to "look right" as I play, so I like you moving the stairs.

    I didn't remember if fighting the rats or walking by the Bandit's door triggered the guards, I was just asking. It looks like using the new stairs location, a party could skip the undead, the ogre, and the Bandit leader. I personally don't care -- in PnP it might make a difference, but in ToEE players are just skipping loot and XP as there are no separate awards for stealthy solutions.

    --thearioch
     
    thearioch, Jul 13, 2008
    #19
  5. Shiningted

    Shiningted I changed this damn title, finally! Administrator

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    Sorry, I'm on a hair trigger nowadays - too much work, not enough modding.

    Skipping stuff is a good point but modding is not about pandering to the metagaming that skipping assumes, either: people only skip what they already know is there.

    Damn I sound negative. I really do like where Gaear is coming from here, I think this actually caused me to get the maps out and figure out what was going on some 3 years ago, but once you understand the maps are differently oriented, for me that was the end of it. Can I just say other people are quite welcome to weigh in here? If the silent majority all get irked by the position of the stairs and want dimensional consistency, I will happily support it. Otherwise I (still) say we stick with the module.
     
    Shiningted, Jul 13, 2008
    #20
  6. windmillcrusadeR

    windmillcrusadeR Windmillcrusader

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    yah, that was funny. I got the maps out to the module as well after reading the original post. Before i read it i though, "kewl, I didn't realize that."

    However, the secrete door in the back was more like an escape route if they guys in the courtyard were getting stomped by invaders (PCs).

    Also, there was a small chance of actually ambushing the bandits the way the module was setup. Plus the bandits had firing positions with AC bonuses. The moat house was a difficult battle for any low level party that did not have some sleep spells ready to go.

    The stratagies for the DM to use made it hazerdous for any PC team to make it through the outside to inside transition without taking some casualties.

    HOwever, being able to "pop in" on the bandits from the back door is a nice option on this version.
     
    windmillcrusadeR, Aug 4, 2008
    #21
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