Darkblade statistics *interesting*

Again, my point is, any attempt to define an original work, like stormbringer and mournblade, in AD&D terms will at best be an approximation. The author no doubt had his own ideas in mind when he created them and wasn't thinking about "is this a +5 unholy avenger I've created here?"

I have no problem with people adapting the idea for their own gaming purposes, I'm just saying that we should all be aware that when we attempt to define foreign lieteray concepts in AD&D gaming terms, there is no exact translation and whatever we might devise would only be an approximation of the original concept.

Just as Aragorn does not directly correspond directly to an AD&D ranger, even though Tolkein called him a ranger. Give the artists their due, that's all.

 

Cult has summmoned twisted sound...

Yes, I like that very much

 

I'm with you on everything except for that last bit about Aragorn. Tolkien was around a lot longer than any version of D&D. First edition rangers correspond exactly with Tolkien's rangers. They were what Gygax used to create the class. I can't think of a single thing one can do that the other one can't. Rangers from subsequent editions are the watered down version that breaks away from the tradition, and if that's what you meant, well...yeah...then I'd have to agree with you on every count.

 

Reallyl? I don't remember everything that 1st edition ranger could do, but I do know they could cast magic-user spells. I don't remember Aragorn having such abilities. I do remember him having magic and herb lore, but that's not the same thing (and proficiencies weren't introduced until last in the 1st edition era). I also don't remember Aragorn attracting followers (unless we consider the fellowship his followers). I don't know that Aragorn ever wore heavy army in the book (I know he did in the movie), but it's been a long time.

But again, my point is, Tolkien wasn't creating Aragorn and the other Rangers of the North to fit into some gaming milieu. I have no doubt Gygax drew heavily from Tolkien in creating the Ranger Class, but I would still argue that Aragorn is not subject to being defined in AD&D terms, though, as I said, we can still make our best approximations to suit are gaming needs and goals.

Anyway, I think we've done this one to death. Anyone notice how I managed to make this all about Tolkien again? ~

 

The use of magic user & druidical spells was given to explain the very things which you describe...magic & herb-lore. Of course he couldn't cast Magic Missile or Tenser's Floating Disc, but AD&D Rangers could because of the rules. Call it "some forgotten power of Westernesse", if you like.

Aragorn's followers were the members of the Grey Company & the Sons of Elrond; doubtless he had others during his many years of travel and service in foreign lands as Thorongil (...among other names)...but probably not a pegasus or hippogriff.

Aragorn wore heavy armor during the battle of the Pelennor Fields; and perhaps at other times as well.

One last thing we agree on...Tolkien definetly didn't create all this just for a game that Gary Gygax would come up with in the future.

 

Laugh. Dang Lord_Spike, you know they were in cohoots and concieved a marketing scheme to make money from it.

Laugh. The trilogy brings about D&D and D&D brings about a following of gamers who when they get older would be prepared for and pay to see the trilogy in movie format as a new all-time high movie ticket income and movie goers then buy more of the trilogy books and start playing D&D. It's a marketing ploy, see? LOL.

 

Speaking of which, when are they going to go back in time in the trilogy and make a movie about Bilbo originally finding the ring and his adventures or, maybe even, back to when the ring was first made? I like the idea of the latter even more than the former.

 

If that were true, they wouldn't have pissed me off by hacking the Council of Elrond sequence so badly, or the Inn at Bree, or the meetting with Galadriel.....................

OK so I didn't mind so much that they had a cave troll in Balin's Tome..........

LOL

 

By the way, Peter Jackson did talk about doing The Hobbit after his King Kong Project. I don't know if he intends to follow through or not..........

BTW, I don't know how familiar you are with the original literature, but the events of the former situation are detailed in the Lord or the Rings prequeal "The Hobbit" and the creation of the One Ring (and all the others as well) are described in the Appendices at the end of The Return of the King and in the Silmarillion. It's good stuff, give it a read.

 

When I was a child prior to my teens [prior to learning about D&D], I started and tried to read my older brothers copy of the LoTR. It was a bit much for my age, and I thought it was too much reading to finish. I never picked it back up. I should complete that.

[EDIT] What spurred my interest was watching the animated version of The Hobbit each one time it was on TV, like once each year. Typically, earlier, military sevice, and in more recent years, college plus the business of my life and, now, work and renewing my computer networking certifications seems to prevent me from reading anything that is not computer and networking related. Hopefully, I will one day learn how to slow down and enjoy more things. This is exactly, one reason why I have recently been devoting time to visiting this web site.

 

I hated the hobbit movie. Instead, I read the LotR & the Silmarillion as often as I can, or at least excerpts. King Kong looks good; I hope the Hobbit movie follows on soon. As far as the other works of Peter Jackson, I picked up the collector's edition dvd's so that the pain was lessened by the added content. Better this than nothing. What movie is like a book, anyway? A friend of mine put it like this: Jackson had to make it so that even NASCAR fans would pay to see it. My relationship with it is love/hate.

Yes, I know...I'm subject to being sheared...Baaa.

(Sorry, Ted...I don't know anyone named Mary)

Krunch, try some Conan. It's quite good, too, and makes for some quicker reading.

 

I saw a real good cartoon version of the hobbit, a friend bought it back from japan. I'm not sure if peter jackson is going to be doing the hobbit or if someone else is going to do it. being a Kiwi and having LotR film here is kinda funny when you can see that someone just moved 500miles in one second - Arwen at the ford, she went from wellington to the shotover river. or that mountain they were on just before moria is a skifield I used to go to when I was a kid.

but to turn a book into a movie, is hard work especially when a movie can only be so long.

 

Dude! Living in Middle Earth...that makes you, like, a 4 legged Aragorn...with fur!

 

I can't remember if its the second or third movie, but if you can remember that bit when faramier and those gondor guys ambush those southron guys and one of the southron guys gets shot and lands at sams feet - that southron guy is a guy I used to work with when I worked at a supermarket, you can buy the action figure I saw it in toyworld once and had a laugh - a doll of Fahad

[EDIT]looked something like this (not this one tho but its the only one I could find on the net)...

 

i like the tolkein and gygax.. marketing theory..

but as anyone who owns a 1st printing copy of demi gods and dieties knows or anyone who has had the misfortune to game with gary early on.. he believs strongly in the pdq bach school of plagurisim not being limited by faulty technique..
1st ed monster manuals actually pre ad&d im talking 1st ed d&d had balrogs..tolkiens estate sued,.1st ed had fafard and greymouser.. fritz liebers publishers sued...
elirc sued....

clearly e..gary gygax in addition to being a real prick and a pain in the ass for his publishers and convention chairmen and i speak as one who gamed with him before tsr was anything more than a group of university/post university students...and also co chaired world cons..

is also a cut rate rip off artist...
...
for a frightningly accurate portrait of him as a human being read shauryn mc crumbs books she wrote two one titled bimbos of the death sun based during a regional SF&f convention accurate in so many respects and lampooning gygax and other famous authours and fans notable to north america cons.