Co8 8.1.0 bugs

Discussion in 'The Temple of Elemental Evil' started by sirchet, Aug 15, 2014.

Remove all ads!
  1. Sitra Achara

    Sitra Achara Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,383
    Likes Received:
    369
    Link in my signature..
     
  2. Shiningted

    Shiningted I want my goat back Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    12,489
    Likes Received:
    279
    Another workaround for this is simply don't use Scather to deal the death blow.
     
  3. RPH

    RPH Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2021
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Is Temple + compatible with the Co8 extra content? I really enjoyed the Verbo stuff and going up to 20th level.
     
  4. Allyx

    Allyx Master Crafter Global Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2004
    Messages:
    4,943
    Likes Received:
    229
    Yes, Temple+ is compatible with Co8 mods, and contains a bunch of fixes and other non-content additions (new races, new classes, new spells, new AI improvements and more).
     
  5. RPH

    RPH Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2021
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks, I will give it a go.
     
  6. RPH

    RPH Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2021
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    I can get the new races under Temple but the prestige classes don't appear when I try and set up a character. I have ticked the box.
     
  7. Pygmy

    Pygmy Established Member Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    Messages:
    518
    Likes Received:
    25
    None of the prestige classes are available at first level. When a character chooses their second level and subsequently all prestige classes will be displayed with those for which the character meets the prerequisites being highlighted.
     
  8. RPH

    RPH Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2021
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks
     
  9. Endarire

    Endarire Ronald Rynnwrathi

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    819
    Likes Received:
    83
    @RPH
    Ensure you have ToEE, Co8 (new content or standard content), and Temple+,
     
  10. Endarire

    Endarire Ronald Rynnwrathi

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    819
    Likes Received:
    83
    Charm monster's duration is bugged: It should be 1 day (24 hours) per caster level instead of 1 hour per caster level! Dominate spells may also be too short!
     
  11. hammyh

    hammyh Established Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2013
    Messages:
    205
    Likes Received:
    34
    I went into an old save game to check Bard's Fascinate DC. It must be bugged. Temple + version 1.0.84

    DC check for an Ogre was 31 !!!

    2nd level bard (Fruella multiclass)
    8 base skill
    3 charisma
    3 horn of fog
    ____________
    14 perform
     
  12. Pygmy

    Pygmy Established Member Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    Messages:
    518
    Likes Received:
    25
    What about the Perform Check (a d20 roll of 17 appears appropriate)?
     
  13. Shiningted

    Shiningted I want my goat back Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    12,489
    Likes Received:
    279
    Fruella has 3 Charisma? That seems high.

    Seriously though, I'll test this.

    EDIT: Ok, the number changes each time (I got 23, 28 and 13). So as Pygmy says, this seems to indicate a rolled perform check, which is what the rules say HERE:
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2021
  14. hammyh

    hammyh Established Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2013
    Messages:
    205
    Likes Received:
    34
    She starts with 16 charisma. She's "pretty" annoying, ha ha.

    Re: Perform Check
    I am unsure of how that particular Perform check works. I think that it was intended to be a DM discretion tweak to how difficult the environment is for the bards "performance" - in order for the song to work in the first place. I don't really think that it was ever intended to be an absolute d20+perform for the DC.

    Before a fight/commotion you might apply the full DC. And as other distractions and fights break out, it may result in a decrease of the DC or complete failure of the song's effect.

    And DC >20 (or even 25, if bard has maybe perform~7) is getting into questionable DC territory. For a 1-2 lvl bard.

    A 20 lvl Bard (perform 37) vs a group of 4 Sirene Cultists rolled DCs of 45,45, 51,52. These are impossible saves for these high-level cultists. Impossible even for a PC with all items and save bonuses (except on a 20).

    This seems crazy OP to me. In ToEE, this ability effectively incapacitates an enemy for a few rounds, much like a sleep spell. As long as the bard does not sing again or cast a spell, they can fight something else without disrupting the fascinate. Consider that a 7th lvl bard can instantly "sleep" three of the toughest monsters in a fight. (Undead and some other are exceptions).

    Another example is the assassin encounter. Mage spells like hold/charm/glitterdust or such have a reasonable chance to neutralize the assassin. This low-level bard song is basically guaranteed to work unless you roll less than average.
    __________________________________________________________________
    TLDR:

    Considering ToEE allows fascinate casting in the middle of combat, I suggest making the save the same as that of the suggestion song:
    Will saving throw (DC 10 + ½ bard’s level + bard’s Cha modifier) negates the effect. Possibly adding perform skill/10 or perform/5 to the DC to promote perform skill investment.

    Thus a lvl 1 bard with 16 charisma would see a DC of 13 . Which is comparable to a wizard with 16 int casting a 1st level spell for a DC of 11+3 = 14.

    A lvl 10 bard with 16 charisma would see DC 18, which is comparable to a wizard with 16 int casting a 5th level spell.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2021
  15. dolio

    dolio Established Member Supporter

    Joined:
    May 30, 2005
    Messages:
    312
    Likes Received:
    59
    It's not even supposed to work in combat, as far as I can tell. Also later:

    Just being an out-of-combat distraction makes the huge will save at least somewhat more reasonable. (Probably makes it useless in the context of this game, though.)
     
    anatoliy likes this.
Our Host!