AI fixes / bug reports

Fixes.

The interaction with npc,s is pretty limited. Can you or will you include more .dlg files for more npc,s like Mother Screng, Lodriss, Scorpp, Rannos, etc.

 

Wizgeorge -

Last night I added a new reputation, some new dialog, and a whole new sub-plot. Also, in the process I discovered a reputation that was already in the game but that was coded wrong (Troika wrote their script with a typo). So there will now be 2 new reputations.

I've actually added a lot of dialog, and even a new quest. I have added new dialog for about 15+ NPCs so far. But last night was the first time that I really sat down and put some major thought into a new sub-plot complete with a reputation to go with it and rumors.

I loved the way you could talk to the NPCs that join your party in Planescape Torment (probably my favorite game of all time). So I plan to put more dialog options in for many of my favorite NPCs.

I wish I had more time. I am torn between doing more and more extra content and just finishing what I have been doing so far and releasing a beta version.

- Livonya

 

The problem with him is that is all alone, so he is a joke to kill. If he was 6th level as in the P&P module then he would die instantly. A live DM can make sure that he is challenging but the only real way that Troika can make him challenging is to beef him up. He is currently a level 10 cleric with 20 monster levels. Even as buffed up as he is it isn't hard for a party to kill him. I gave him a great AI script and he now uses powerful spells, but even so my level 5 party can kill him off... though it is hard.

I know you really want the game to follow the rules, but the problem is that TOEE does not have a live DM who can think and create and adapt. The computer simply can't do what a DM can do. Monsters and situations need to cheat a little otherwise they are simply too easy.

So I am all for following the rules, but at the same time I want a fun and challenging game. Striking a balance is always hard, but I think this is one situation where following the P&P module would simply make a boring game.

What I am trying to do is to make the game more complex and difficult and interesting without breaking the rules... in the process I am finding a billion examples of places were Troika fudged the rules to make the game more challenging... I am not removing those fudges unless I can do so without detracting from the challenge. In a way I consider those to be "house rules."

Ultimately, I can make Terjan a lower level character without 5 attacks, but how do I do that without making him too easy to kill?

Would you rather play a fun challenging game that sometimes fudges the rules, or a very boring and easy game that follows every rule?

I don't think rules should come at the expense of the game quality... which is exactly why a live DM has the freedom to create, modify, and alter the rules to fit the situation needed.

- Livonya

 

Livonya,

First of all, Thank you for all of your hard work on this. One thing I would like is some kind of warning when your paladin is going to fall. I mean having a paladin fall for getting in a drinking contest seems a little harsh. Maybe if it is possible a holy sword to be found. Are you able to work on skills? It seems that you cannot cross class in skills. I may be wrong it has been a long time since I played p&p. Any idea when you might be finished?

 

Livonya

id like to join in with the others to thank you for all the work your putting into this. im looking foward to seeing this in action when you get it done. you could release the beta version now and work on more additions and improvments for another release later. i dont know much about scripting or programing but id be happy to help if i could. id love to see some more mods to continue this adventure spreading it out farther if that is possible. ive got all kinds of AD&D works to draw on for ideas and info but no real way to put it into the game.

i was also wondering about mother Screng. i usally do a NG game which starts with finding a dead canoness Y'dey supposedly but in the original mod mother screng was canoness y'dey in disguise. i havent seen anything in the game about it and was wondering if it was something they didnt finish or just left out

 

ok i hit a new bug i never ran across before playing. after getting lareth's diary and reading it to get the location of nulb i instead get this goofy message

" you cant seem to find any visible script written on the pages of this diary. either this guy was extremely boring or the developers decided he wasnt important enough to make his book work. even though the text is in the help file, and that he had nothing to say about the ho hum exsistance he must live as an incognito servant of loth working along side the forces of the elemental planes"

and no location of nulb on the map so i cant go any farther in the game. i must say this is very annoying. has anyone else seen this before or found a way around it.

 

ok that wasnt a but its a line in the long discription mes file....left over from vicks and wedges mod...now i just have to figure out how to get around it without starting over

 

I guess I don't understand why Terjon has to be ridiculously powerful. I don't think it detracts from the game to have him be a 10th level cleric or whatever. If players want to kill gods, they already have their oppurtunity with Iuz, St. Cuthbert and Ziggmutoy. Why should the cleric of a podunk little villiage be god-like? And that's what a 30th level character is.

I agree, things are going to be easier than against a real live DM, but on the flipside the player's options are also going to be restricted. You can't snag an NPC with a rope in ToEE and then drag them past your fighters so they can beat on him or bullrush a bodak into a lava pool or leap on top of that table between you and the ogre to fight him instead of taking the long way around.

I just don't think obeying the rules and having the fights be sufficiently challenging are necessarily mutually exclusive.

My vote would be to leave Terjon level 10 so he can continue to offer the party raise dead without the illogic of being unable to heal Bing. If parties can kill him, fine, as long as he only offers up the XP and treasure appropriate to his level it's fair. Add something in like Gaere suggested where Calmert comes to his aid. It's can either be automatic after a certain number or rounds, or depend on Calmert succeeding on a low DC listen check to hear the sounds of combat. This would both make sense and add to the difficulty of the fight in a logical way. Barring that, you could add a couple ofllow-level sub-priests or even some Burne's badgers who hang out in the other rooms of the top level of the church and come to Terjon's aid if he's attacked.

Personally, the fight I'd like to see toughened up would be Ramos and Gremag, who put up pitiful resistance for what level they are. A dialogue option that leads to combat would be nice too, particularly if the player has discovered them to be spies and had the assassin come after him.

 

Hmm...I hadn't realised that they made Terjon level 30. I wonder if they realise that makes him more powerful than the named characters of Greyhawk: Lord Robilar, Tenser, Ottiluke, Erac's Cousin, Mordenkainen and Bigby....to name but a few.

I must also take a moment and thank you Livonya for all your hard work. It sounds absolutely wonderful what you have done and I hope it makes the game far more rich and rewarding. It will actually be nice to have Lareth come out and help his troops so as to give my party an actual challenge.

I only have a few suggestions, and I think one has been addressed before, but Im not sure.

1.) I would actually like more colours for the cloaks and clothing in the game. As someone that is a bit 'anal' about things, it just rubs me the wrong way that the colour selections are so limited.

2.) Is there any way to mod the game to have new races like Half-Ogres and/or subraces of the main races, such as Wood Elves, Grey Elves and the like? Also, is there a way to actually offer a few more PC classes to the game such as the Noble (from either the DragonLance Campaign or Blackmoor Campaign books), the Marshall (from the Miniatures Handbook) or maybe even make it to where you can make variants of the main classes (like the non-spell casting Ranger from Unearthed Arcana)?

3.) I don't know if this is a hardcode problem or something else. Again, Im a bit anal about certain things. I hate the encumbrance and inventory system as it stands. Not only is it totally unrealistic (being able to carry several sets of armour in a backpack), it would actually serve the game better to allow the party to get a pack mule or two (they have them in Dungeon Seige II I believe) to be the main 'load bearers'. Is this possible or is this totally pie in the sky?

Anyway, again, profuse thanks. You're doing a kick-butt job.

 

Well, this is the D&D encumberance system, which only really worries about weight, so you can't really blame Troika for the implementation of that one. It doesn't bother me that it's generic and unrealistic because to be honest inventory management isn't really a fun or exciting aspect of any game. It's got enough restriction you can't carry out a whole dungeon on your back without getting in the way of normal gameplay. The only thing that really needs to be fixed about it is the quick weapons slots.

I do agree with you that it'd be interesting if someone could find a way to add classes and races. Or better yet, Prestige classes like the Arcane Trickster and Eldritch Knight for people who like playing old-school Thief/Mages and Fighter/Mages. I know there's a "prestige class level" python command you can use from the console (that doesn't actually do anything) so Troika must have at least toyed with the idea.

 

Originally there were going to bags of holding, but for whatever reason they were left out of the final game. I wonder if it is possible to put them back in.

 

Okay, I figured out what to do with Terjon.

He will no longer be level 30. I have re-made him. He will be a challenge, but he will not be a god... so no 5 attacks per round.

Hopefully, what I have done will be a better balance between having a nice hard fight and also following the rules.

His stats are still fudged but not in a way that you will go "that is lame, he can't be doing that!"

- Livonya

 

id enjoy more classes too. im more use to AD&D ver 2.5 than ver 3 so id enjoy seeing the class kits. like bard blades, archer rangers, cavaliers, barbarian shamans and such. some more race special items would be cool. we have elven cloaks, boots, chain but not much for the others like dawarven plate. i do enjoy the game alot and enjoy it more everytime all you people working so hard on it add something else to it and hopefully it will be able to continue for sometime or at least untill we can find someone with alot of money to fund an complete expansion for it lol.

 

I cannot thank you enough for your work. What more can I say; if I could do more, I would.

It is a fine line between being too hard and too easy. Many on this board are avid D+D fans, and know the difference. It can be hard at times putting away biases that may or may not be blatant. I am more interested in being able to find more "spice" in the game: extra interesting wandering encounters (extra hard evil/good parties) or Gorgons with real D+D abilities. You only encounter them in the earth node and they are lame.

Making encounters such that the spellcasters are actually a challenge and "prebuff" their allies would be wonderfull. As it stands, Senshock is not much of a challenge by the time most get to him, neither is Falrinth. IF they are of the level they are, I would expect that a party of 5, around level 6, should have a HELL of a time getting past him. After all, he guards the ORB. Anyone so entrusted should be painful. Smegmal Redhand could be made more painful too, she has excellent armour and money to betrothe, it should be a challenge. But that is what it should be