Multi-class character help

I have never multi-classed a character in any D&D type game. Browsing around the threads here, it seems to be a popular thing to do.

Would anybody be able give me pointers on it? I really dont understand what happens when you do it. Do you keep all your abilities from your first class when going to another? Stuff like that.

If there is already a thread here about it already....link? I havent found one.

 

I do not multiclass. However, I know that you need to keep your levels within one level of each other or else you get exp penalities (unless you are human I believe). So an elf with 4 levels in wizard and 2 in fighter gets reduced exp. I believe there are some other rules regarding racial multiclassing.

 

Each race has a favored class and if that class is one of the multi-classed options then they will not receive the XP penalty. Which is %10 by the way.

In Ranth's example his elf Wiz-4/Ftr-2 would not have a penalty because Wizard is a favored class for Elves.

You can change each level if you wish, but certain combos are more effective.

Fighter is a good class to dip into because you get more weapon profs and an extra feat.

A couple levels of rogue(first two are best) gives you evasion and some sneak attack damage along with lock picking and trap abilities.

Just try different things and see what you like.

 

The general advice is that spellcasters shouldn't be multi-classed, while for front-line fighters it's okay. One of my favorite combos is a high-dex fighter with 2 levels of barbarian for uncanny dodge.

Some combos are just plain bad. I'd really like a way for a cleric/mage -- one of my favorite character builds from 2nd Edition -- to be viable in this game. It just doesn't work very well.

The SRD has a good overview of how casting class, BAB, HP and saving throws work for multi-classing: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/multiclass.htm

 

As others have mentioned, be careful of which classes and race you might be tempted to multiclass is. Also be aware that any non fighter type class you add will not give you any BaB, so if you are silly enough to go 1 level in each of rogue, bard, cleric, druid. monk, mage, and sorcerer, you would have 0 (ZERO) base BaB and only 1 attack.

Each of the abilities and spells of each class are kept, though wearing certain items or becoming a fallen paladin will override or negate them.,

 

Another question...

Lets say I'm a 3rd lvl barbarian and I want to multiclass in fighter. How does the experience work? Does my leveling in barbarian stop? Will I be able to lvl up again in barbarian? Will I only habe the option to level up when I have enough exp to go to Bar4/F2? Will it give me an option to lvl up when I get enough exp to either class?

 

Levelling up depends on character level, which is comprised of class levels (of any type). So, the amount of experience required to go from character level 5 to character level 6 will always be the same no matter what classes the character is composed of. So, a Barb4/Fighter2 (6 levels) will require 21,000 XP to advance to level 7. This is true no matter what combination of class levels make up the six character levels.

Tangentally, the paladin and monk are the only two classes that will stop advancement in those classes if another is selected. So, if you select paladin class levels and then switch to another class (say, Fighter) you will be unable to advance the Paladin class again (but you don't lose any of the abilities). The same is true for monk.

 

That is one of the things that I do not like about TOEE. It was nice in NWN to dabble in one of those classes, add another, and still be able to go back to add levels as a monk or a paladin. I know it is hard coded in the game, but never agreed with the stance you could not be a multiclassed monk or paladin without some restriction or penalty. But that is just my own opinion, so take it for what it is.

 

I dont multi-class so much, but there are some good options here.
Fighter/rogue is a good choice for frontman, with good number of feats, plus the sneak attack damages, and some skill points to pick locks, disarm traps and for tumble. With high Dexterity, a good choice is a ranger/rogue for better number of skill points plus great high tumble. Good choice either for a secoundary frontman - with good move 'cose of the light armour and high tumble, it's very eficient to go anywhere and flank - or for a bowman. For a secoundary hitter, two or three levels of barbarian - for the BaB, hit points and more move - and then rogue levels makes a decent choice too.
I like too four or five levels of paladin - for the fear aura and maybe some spells - and then fighter (what makes an excelent frontmman) or cleric (for good secoundary frontman and buffer/healer).
Finaly, bard/rogue makes excelent faceman, with a bag full of tricks. Not a good fighter, but an excelent jack-of-all-trades.

 

You can actually make a great warrior with all the advantages you mentioned about a bard/rogue by making a bard/rogue/barb which I like to call a ''Skald'' .

A bard/rogue/barb can also be faceman with all the skill points bard/rogue/barb classes give, have access to lock and traps abilities and be more powerful than a pure fighter or barb:

By having a little sneak attack
By moving faster (+10 by barb class)
By having access to haste
By relying on blur and displacement to mitigate damage rather than AC or unless you have high dex but is not a must...
By singing for more damage, trancing and buffs
By stacking Bull Strength and Barbarian Rage for a ridiculous +8 str achievable very early

Must have high stats (18 preferably) in strength only. The other are entirely dependent on what areas you prefer to focus:

DEX allows you to get high AC in light armor and therefore you wont need blur and displacement as much. Blur is great for easy fights while displacement is used for tougher fights. DEX also helps your locksmith skill. Reflex saves are hardly needed in this game considering the few traps.

CON allows your rage to last longer and ofc have more hp. Barbarian lvls will grant you lots of hp however, so it depends on which weapon you want to use. If you're using a reach weapon, you dont need a very high CON but if you use a close quarter weapon like a greatsword, then a CON of at least 12 is recommended which is still pretty easy to get. Besides from the frequent trip attempts and poisons, your CON saves should still be pretty high thx to Barbarian Rage extra CON just so you know.

INT helps being a good faceman and disabling traps mainly by boosting certain faceman skills such as Appraise and giving u more skillpoints. I do not recommend going the Whirlwind path (requiring 13 INT for Combat Expertise) as you will be restrained on feats. You want a minimum of 10 INT... Rogue/Bard/Barb are all classes that give a faire amount of skillpoints.

WIS affects certain faceman skills such as Sense Motive and gives you some Will saves which are not very useful considering few fights involve spellcasters. This is a dumpstat imo, you can go as low as 8.

CHA afffects most faceman skills such as Intimidate and Diplomacy, also affects your song power to fascinate monsters (Fascinate is an excellent song to trance tough monsters so you can delay their actions and mop the floor with the weaker mosnters first) and affect your DC on all your offensive spells. But the dilemma is this: Since you're a more than capable warrior, should you use your spells only to buff yourself or do you want to also be able to throw some offensive magic in tougher fights, such as a Sound Burst when you are heavily outnumbered? If you are confident in your ''Skald''s ability to just Cleave and Great Cleave through the hordes of mobs, then you clearly dont need offensive magic or a high CHA (in this case, a CHA score of 12 is more than enough). Remember, Fascinate can be used to trance any tough opponent also and only require a high Perform skill. However, if you feel like you need offensive magic, then a high score of CHA is a MUST (18 CHA recommended).

 

ToEE is actually true to the official rules on this. Icewind Dale 2 has an interesting exception, in that you can have, say, a paladin of Mystra that can freely multiclass with wizard. I'm not sure if that has any basis in the official rules, though.

I'd say I'm not sure how NWN dropped this, but it plays loose with a lot of rules. For instance, there's almost no connection between your deity and your available cleric domains.

Yeah, it's a bummer. Back in original 3rd edition, I think they thought that mixing and matching classes would just work out. And it does for straight melee types, because they tend to be based around feats and BAB, which stack appropriately from multiple sources. So a 10 fighter/10 barbarian can hit things about as well as a 20 fighter and a 20 barbarian.

But, priests and mages get a lot of their power from spells, and those don't stack. Sure, you can have both, but twice as many 1st-5th level spells (less, really) aren't an adequate substitute for 6th-9th level spells. So a 10 cleric/10 wizard isn't anywhere near as good as a 20 cleric or a 20 wizard. It's more like a very beefy 10 cleric or 10 wizard (due to having more hitpoints, BAB and saves). 2nd edition acknowledged this by essentially letting you buy your first wizard level for the same amount of experience regardless of how many other levels you had. So your choice wasn't 20 versus 10/10, it was 20 versus 15/15 or something like that. But this can't be done in 3rd edition, because of the things that do stack, like BAB and feats. Who wouldn't want to be a 15 fighter/15 barbarian instead of a 20 fighter? Well, a 2nd edition player wouldn't, because THAC0 doesn't stack.

Instead, we got prestige classes that build both. Mystic theurge requires you to start as a crappy wizard/cleric, but eventually progresses both at the same time to keep you from sucking too much (although you still stink from a powergaming view). It's adequate, and I kind of like prestige classes, but it'd be interesting to see if one could make wizard and cleric levels (etc.) stack appropriately to fulfill the original 3rd edition idea.*

And of course, in especially vanilla games like ToEE, it really limits the useful combinations.

* This has been done for other classes. One book has the "daring outlaw" feat, which lets rogue and swashbuckler levels stack for the purposes of sneak attack and some of the swashbuckler class features. You could probably invent a similar feat to obselete mystic theurge. Say: all but 3 of your cleric levels count as wizard levels for spellcasting, and vice versa. In fact, that's better than mystic theurge, because you can improve your turn undead, BAB and domain powers by gaining cleric levels, or get bonus feats by taking wizard levels, whereas mystic theurge gives you neither.

 

I have pondered making a "Skald" on DDO. I already have a Barb Bard.

 

Good info. thanx all

 

Can I assume that a party of 5 created characters will level up faster that one of 8, because the same ammount of XP is being divided up betweem less characters.

 

Yes, with the exception if you have multi classed with races and classes out of order and level differences. Smaller parties get more XP, but will also level up faster so may throw off balance of play depending on your play style and were you go.