Discussion of gazra_1971's Game Guide

Discussion in 'The Temple of Elemental Evil' started by Gaear, Jan 13, 2011.

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  1. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    Thanks for the game guide and walkthrough, gazra. :thumbsup:

    Some observations:

    Ah Fong actually works properly now.

    Do you mean the ambush fight at Welkwood Bog? If so, that's (originally) Wilfrick, (now) Canon Thaddeus. Glad you found it challenging btw ... some people originally complained that it was easy. Care to elaborate on your difficulty?

    General FYI - many NPCs are now scripted to seek out the party leader, particularly in the NC.

    I think Renton is actually always inside.
     
  2. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt Veteran Member

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    I'm surprised that you find the White Dragon challenging. Maybe I just always get there too late...

    And IMO the salamanders in Fire Temple are nothing like the Salamander battle in the Fire Node.

    Also, surprised that you don't list the Lareth garrison battle as challenging.

    War domain isn't required, just the "Divine Power" spell.


    As for the fighter feat progression, I usually prefer to take the wpn focus/specialization feats as soon as available, because those +1 bonuses matter a lot more early on in the game than later.
     
  3. Avatar_do_Grafite

    Avatar_do_Grafite Established Member

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    I have just seen some little (really very little) information missing on the guide.


    About the Holy Weapons ya shall find in the game (item 9):

    Holy Greataxe +1 (Chest in Fire Node); This chest haven't a Frostburn (a greatsword)?


    About the recruitable NPCs (item 10):

    morgan will leave the group and go back to his cell on the Temple every time the group arives Nulb, but he shall be hired again and again every time - or knocked off after the group drive to Nulb...

    Ashren won't join or stay in your party while Taki is in your party


    The Nulb Ambush (item 11):

    I always think - and I actually have done this sometimes - that just one of the two merchants shall escape alive from the enconter on the Trading Post, not both of them. This have being changed in the latest modes?



    Finally, I totally agree with Aussdoerrt about the salamanders. The ones of the Fire Node are a damn big trouble even for groups of high level!
     
  4. Sitra Achara

    Sitra Achara Senior Member

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    Re. Node Salamanders and Ice Tyrants,

    the increased difficulty is no doubt due to the implementation of the node rules regarding spell effects (namely that fire spells do double damage in the Fire Node and likewise for Cold spells in the Water Node). This was introduced a while back to conform to the original module - are you guys finding it over the top?
     
  5. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt Veteran Member

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    Haven't experienced it yet - I've got to yet find time to play 6.0. The samalanders/ice tyrants have always been a tough fight anyway.
     
  6. Forgalz

    Forgalz Established Member

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    No. These fights require some planning, but are very doable.
     
  7. gazra_1971

    gazra_1971 Knights of Legend

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    Thanks for reporting all of those corrections, guys. Keep them coming.

    Yeah, I meant Wilfrick. I am dyslexic, so I make a lot of errors when writing (plus, I type most of my posts in the Co8 forum in the wee hours of the night, so I make a lot of mistakes due to tiredness). I did that combat without ANY prebuffing spells and without creating any Rings of Elemental Resistance for my characters beforehand, so the combat was more difficult than it could have been for me. My party took a lot of damage from area effect elemental damage spells (including Flame Strikes), but it was the most fun combat in the game for me.

    Again, I did that combat without ANY prebuffing spells and without creating any rings of cold resistance, so the combat was more difficult for me than it could have been. As a result, my party took a lot of damage form the dragon's cold breath attacks before the dragon died. Ausdoerrt, I'm surprised that you didn't find that combat challenging. I had no idea that the dragon was there the first time that I blundered into it. Ausdoerrt, what tactics did you use to defeat the adult white dragon?

    I meant the most "powerful" adversaries in the game, not the most difficult combats that one experiences while playing the game from start to finish. You are right, when playing the game with a weak party, the Lareth combat is extremely challenging. But when power-gaming (i.e. playing the game with the most powerful party that you can conceive), the Lareth combat is a cakewalk. It's all relative. Whereas, the most powerful adversaries in the game are always going to be the most powerful adversaries in the game (no matter what you do in the game, or what party you play the game with).

    I don't understand what you mean. Ausdoerrt, would you care to clarify what you mean by this?

    Avatar_do_Grafite, Frost Brand (the magical greatsword which, in my opinion, is the best looking weapon in the game by far!) is in the Fire Temple Chest guarded by Bassanio and the 2 Noble Salanders and all of the Flamebrothers (in the Temple of Elemental Evil dungeon level 2).

    You are right, Avatar_do_Grafite, only 1 of the dodgy traders actually needs to escape in order for the Nulb ambush to trigger properly, but I always let both of them escape just to be on the safe side (plus it makes more sense from a role-playing point-of-view (because, otherwise, how would a dead trader's inventory items be in the trader's inventory in the Nulb ambush?).

    That's an understatement!

    Forgalz is spot on with his assessment. Although, with my weaker party that I am playing this time around (a player-made rogue, 2 player-made half-orc fighters, and the NPCs Meleny, Pishella, Serena, Riana, and Kella), I'm not confident of being able to win the combats against the slave traders or the Hezrou Guardian or the 2 Gorgons or the 6 Noble Salamanders guarding the chest in the Fire Node.

    An evil grin formed on my face when I read this. Boy, Ausdoerrt, are you in for a rude awakening when you do those 2 combats. Let me know how you fared once you've done those 2 combats. I would be very curious to know!
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2011
  8. Avatar_do_Grafite

    Avatar_do_Grafite Established Member

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    Fire node, fire temple... I always mix up the two... My bad.


    I don't understand what ya mean. gazra_1971, would ya care to clarify what you mean by this? If ya kill one of the traders in the trading post, ya loot his inventory there. The other one will be looted after ya kill him on the Nulb Ambush...


    And what about Morgan and Ashren?
     
  9. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt Veteran Member

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    I dunno, I just do my usual combat buffs (bull strength, bear's endurance, cat's grace, heroism, etc.) and whack away while mages throw combat spells from the back. Of course, it's helpful to have elemental resistance buffs and spell penetration for mages. One helpful tip is not to charge the dragon right away, that way he throws the concealment spell in a way that it doesn't affect him; after that just whack him down. You do take a lot of damage, but I've rarely had anyone die in that battle. Maybe the problem is that I don't get to Verbo until late in the game, so I'm all overleveled. Regardless, it's certainly a lot easier than the Balor fight...

    My bad, it seems like I confused NODE with TEMPLE once again just like Avatar_d._G. did.

    Fair enough. In that case... no Zuggy?

    Fragarach/Scather used to use a similar weapon model in vanilla. That's why one of the first things I do before starting a game is make sure I have the old weapon models enabled.
     
  10. Avatar_do_Grafite

    Avatar_do_Grafite Established Member

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    There are a way to have the old model in the game?! Oh, my! How shall I do that?!

    Sorry, not the right thread, I know, but I just can't miss the oportunity to know how to have the old and badass model of Fragarach (more precisely, Scather) back!
     
  11. Sitra Achara

    Sitra Achara Senior Member

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    Read the FAQ - Temple Section :)

    Also, I've advocated bringing it back before. All in favor say aye!
     
  12. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt Veteran Member

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    Check the FAQ and references thread under "Fragarach & Scather".

    Damn, ninja'd.
     
  13. gazra_1971

    gazra_1971 Knights of Legend

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    If you kill one of the traders, does he not show up again in the Nulb ambush?

    Avatar_do_Grafite, I've already implemented your corrections regarding Morgan and Ashrem in the game guide. But thanks again for the corrections, and keep them coming.

    Zuggy is weak. Too weak for my liking! See when Prince Thrommel sinks Fragarach into Zuggtmoy in the intro of the computer game? Now that's what I call a lame demoness!

    Please, oh PLEASE, will you change Fragarach's and Scather's graphics back to the way that they were in the original game? That's a BIG aye from me!
    Why were they altered to the dull graphics that they have now?
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2011
  14. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt Veteran Member

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    In some 10-odd playthroughs of TOEE with older modpacks, it has always worked properly for me: only the trader(s) alive will show up. If you kill both, the ambush won't happen at all.

    IIRC, to conform to the way it looks in the intro. And there it looks like any regular bastard sword. I doubt the old ones will be brought back, but the models are still in the game files, and as I mentioned it only takes a minor edit to use them instead.
     
  15. Avatar_do_Grafite

    Avatar_do_Grafite Established Member

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    Aye. I have done this quest a lot of times, and only the surviving trader come after me with some thugs. The other one just keep dead.
     
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