How Games Have Changed

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Ranth, Jun 23, 2010.

Remove all ads!
  1. Ranth

    Ranth Established Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    829
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gaear's poll has me thinking. What do you enjoy in games? I look at the current gaming industry, and feel sad. I almost never buy new games (nor illegally download) because nothing seems to appeal to me anymore. That kinda scared me in a way, and I dont know why.

    As we know, I love ToEE, I liked World of Warcraft too. WoW was fun, but alot of it was the social aspects to play with friends, not sure if I would have soloed the entire thing. I am also a huge fan of Ultima Online and occasionally play on a free server that has the classic rule set.

    Ultima Online has terrible 2d graphics. But the game systems are great and the world is immerse. You can have a castle if you work hard enough for it. There was also risk, if I died, I would lose all of my gear, including magic gear and all my money on me if someone looted me.

    ToEE graphics are better than UO, but we can all agree they are not on par with today's graphics. What sets it apart for me is the strategy and the ability to use logic to defeat an opponent. I truely love the strategy aspect, and turn based combat allows me to think about what I am doing instead of mashing buttons.

    You would think with the millions of dollars spent on games these days, a lot of it has to go into combat systems and content. I am sure it does. But it still doesnt lure me. I guess the elusive thing I am looking for is the ability to 'buy into' a game. To believe in it (the world in UO's case, the system in ToEE's case). I guess I need to buy a game to see if I do buy in. I just feel like games today involve little thought, and maybe that is what I am seeking. Mental challenges.

    Please dont take this as a mean spirited rant. It is not. It is free flowing thoughts and I am interested in everyone's ideas.
     
  2. Necroticpus

    Necroticpus Cthulhu Ftaghn!

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,379
    Likes Received:
    0
    I haven't bought a computer game in years and years. I think the last one I bought was between 1998 and 2001. I think maybe it was Warcraft III. Actually, I bought World Of Warcraft after that but I don't consider that a game.

    In order for me to buy a game, I have to believe that the company invested more in the game mechanics than the graphics. I won't ever buy any game that has the most current video card on the market as the recommended requirements. I also will never buy another MMORPG. Or sports games. I really like single player games. They can be of any genre as long as it is good.

    The only games that I'm looking foward to are Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3. Blizzard never fails in their games. And the requirements for these new games that haven't came out yet are such that you can run and play them on a machine that was built about a year ago. That really draws my respect and admiration.

    I am still of the old school of gaming. The great grandfather of all games, the original Doom and the Ultimate Doom, for me, cannot ever be overshadowed by any game that has came out since or any game that will be released in the future. It has amazing single player and deathmatch, and I believe it was 16 bit graphics.
     
  3. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2004
    Messages:
    11,029
    Likes Received:
    42
    I think that depends on personal taste. A lot of people seem to think that 3D graphics on platforms like NWN, Oblivion, etc. are fundamentally weak, probably because they have to be dynamic. A static 2D background like in ToEE can be as richly illustrated as you like, however, and it won't impact game performance at all. I guess 2D may have its own intrinsic limitations when compared to 3D though.

    I agree that Doom was basically the gold standard. I remember playing that tirelessly in the early nineties - just pure, unadulterated fun. But as far as tactical combat goes, the Goldbox games were its equivalent, imo. Which, not coincidentally, is why ToEE is such a godsend to gamers: it has a great deal in common with the Goldbox stuff as far as tactical turn-based combat goes, only with far, far, far, far better graphics. I'm not really a graphics whore, but Goldbox games are basically unplayable to me now simply because their graphics are so outdated. (You've got to draw a line of acceptability somewhere, I think. Otherwise we'd all be playing Stratego on our kitchen tables.)

    So, once again, thank goodness Troika made ToEE before they went under. And if Darkstorm ever gets his port finished and ToEE's beta release engine problems worked out, we'll be even better off. :yes:
     
  4. Ranth

    Ranth Established Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    829
    Likes Received:
    0
    Regarding DarkStorm's engine, I wonder if we could use the 3.5 D&D ruleset and make a new game without licensing the ruleset from Wizards. The only reason I think this is because there is now the Open Gaming License from Wizards that allows other companies to use/modify old rule sets and create their own games.

    That is why there are derivative gaming systems (from White Wolf and others) that use a lot of 3.5 D&D rules but dont use anything from 4th Edition (with OGL). I wonder if we could do the same, release a game with his engine using 3.5 rules. We would need some top notch artists, but we all have enough smarts to develop a story and adventure. I think Necro would be a great writer :)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Game_License
     
  5. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2004
    Messages:
    11,029
    Likes Received:
    42
    Well, KotB is basically a new game, made without any permissions. The key is the profit aspect though. Making a new game with the modified engine as a commercial venture would still be theft, I think, because the port is based on the original Troika/Atari engine, regardless of the ruleset. As long as you just do this stuff for free as an amateur, no one seems to care, but the moment a dollar stands to be made (or lost), watch out.

    So if you mean make a new game for sale, personally I wouldn't try my luck with anything commercial with Atari or WotC. If you mean make a new game for free, we've already done it. As for new projects, that's a big, big job, and supposedly 'committed' people crap out on that stuff all the time, so it's not to be undertaken lightly.
     
  6. Necroticpus

    Necroticpus Cthulhu Ftaghn!

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,379
    Likes Received:
    0
    I would be willing to contribute whatever my meager skills could provide if you so decide. I like writing so that part wouldn't seem like a job to me. If you can do something you enjoy, it comes naturally. If it feels like a job, the quality will suffer. I would really like to write fantasy storylines for stuff. That would be fun.

    But don't ask me to script or program or java or HTML or flash or SQL or fortran or pascal or cobol or VB or anything like that. I know less than zero about syntax and haven't a clue about the first principles about programming. The most complicated programming I can do is link 1 or 2 simple tables in M$ Access, and only if I have an M$ Access for Dumbasses book in front of me. :dribble:
     
  7. Ranth

    Ranth Established Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    829
    Likes Received:
    0
    Actually, I think I can use 3.5 rules as long as a I include the open gaming license and give people a way to use it or modify it. I am getting this info from the last part of here: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/oglfaq/20040123f

    Quote: Q: I want to distribute computer software using the OGL. Is that possible?

    A: Yes, it's certainly possible. The most significant thing that will impact your effort is that you have to give all the recipients the right to extract and use any Open Game Content you've included in your application, and you have to clearly identify what part of the software is Open Game Content.

    One way is to design your application so that all the Open Game Content resides in files that are human-readable (that is, in a format that can be opened and understood by a reasonable person). Another is to have all the data used by the program viewable somehow while the program runs.

    Distributing the source code not an acceptable method of compliance. First off, most programming languages are not easy to understand if the user hasnÍt studied the language. Second, the source code is a separate entity from the executable file. The user must have access to the actual Open Content used.


    EDIT: Apparently the OGL allows a person to use the game mechanics of 3.5, but it doesnt let us use anything specific to D&D, such as spell names and descriptions.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2010
  8. Shiningted

    Shiningted I want my goat back Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    12,654
    Likes Received:
    352
    Yah: no Rary or Mordenkainen, no beholders, no experience table. Check the limitations here:

    http://www.d20srd.org/faq.htm

    Otherwise very doable. Eg, KotC which was heavily indebted to the d20 rules.

    Don't ask me how Tarol Hunt gets away with a yuan-ti, though: Rich Burlew wouldn't do it.
     
  9. Necroticpus

    Necroticpus Cthulhu Ftaghn!

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,379
    Likes Received:
    0
    I just bought Max Payne today for $1 at a rummage sale. Not bad. I remember when this first came out and everyone was making a big fat hairy deal about it because it's the first game that used "bullet time", when you can slow time down and do a bunch of things in normal time so you never are in any danger of getting hurt or dying, just like every game that comes out now.

    *edit*
    I also like Stratego and Risk and Axis & Allies very much. I haven't played any of them in years, but I would if given the chance. Except maybe for Axis & Allies. That was pretty much a game you started on Friday after school and finished up sometime Sunday afternoon, if you were lucky and moving things along.

    *edit #2*
    What's KoTC? Keep On The Circle of eight?
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2010
  10. Ranth

    Ranth Established Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    829
    Likes Received:
    0
    I hear there is a new computer game called Axis and Allies Tactics. From what I have heard, you can play the original game, but it comes with some expansion that is a lot more fun and interesting with different races or something.

    Weird, but I cannot find the game on Google now...

    Nevermind, it is Risk: Factions
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2010
  11. Bob Corncob

    Bob Corncob Maverick Moon Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2007
    Messages:
    66
    Likes Received:
    0
    KotC = Knights of the Chalice. It's very old school, looks alot like the Dark Sun games & is turn-based d20. Been awhile since I played, but its pretty good considering it was a one-man development team.

    http://www.heroicfantasygames.com/
     
  12. nevaeh

    nevaeh Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't know if all people do this, but I personally, and periodically just sit down and think about things. Such moments generally occur before bed, right before I go to sleep. I'll wonder why things are, how things are, and how those things can be changed. Usually, I never seem to put these things into action. But, this time, I decided to. I needed to write an editorial, and here it is. This editorial revolves around my view of the video game industry. This review is a little back and forth, a little unorganized, sometimes even pointless, but it gets my point out. Either way, if you have thoughts at all about gaming, I recommend that you read this editorial. While you may not agree with my views, it should at least make you think a little bit about how games have evolved. While I won't call this an official "Write Off" if you have any thoughts on such things, either leave a comment or write your own mini editorial including them. Ponder, and enjoy!
     
  13. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2004
    Messages:
    11,029
    Likes Received:
    42
    So where's the editorial??

    We don't allow advertising spam in signatures, so yours have been nullified. You do seem to be making marginally topical posts in various threads today though, which is the only reason you're not banned already, given the ads and the weird vibe you've got going so far. But you really, really need to start resembling more a genuine person and less a spambot if you want to make it much longer. We are watching.
     
  14. GuardianAngel82

    GuardianAngel82 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2007
    Messages:
    3,481
    Likes Received:
    5
    There's certainly an inconsistency of style and a lack of discernable personality in the posts. Plus, the posts are all pointless and seem cut and paste. Clever, but not yet Touring quality.

    Spambot.
     
  15. Necroticpus

    Necroticpus Cthulhu Ftaghn!

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,379
    Likes Received:
    0
    Just installed American Mcgee's Alice and Serious Sam: First and Second encounter, after years of not playing them. Alice is just plain downright cool and fun and Serious Sam is...serious action, every second in the game.
     
Our Host!