Craft Magical Arms and Armor

Well said Spike. Crude, but to the gist.

I know I lost the "I said this, you said this" thread a few freakin' posts ago!

Does it really matter? Was Kyriff's question answered? If, by more than one person's input, let KYRIFF decide what they thought was said by whom!

No need to stir up trouble with another poster to prove who is "right" about whether that poster said! That poster knows if they meant to give a view dissenting from another poster's.

Sometimes we argue with other posters to make our point(i.e. Butchers of Homlett thread), and sometimes we mess with each other a little(i.e. my messing with Spike alittle in the Cam-ho post- again sorry if I did it too much Spikey), but to incessantly drone on about whether someone is actually arguing with you or not, filling up thread space is not good. It really should be up the originator of the thread to take what they will from the all the alternative positions- provided by all the posters.

 

"+5" was an oversimplification on my part meant to clearly describe a powerful item in simple terms...I shoulda used quotes, or something. Please remember that I usually think in Greyhawk & 1st Edition terms, where crafting per se didn't exist, and nearly everything about the manufacture of such durable goods was "house ruled." BTW, I could tell you were just messin' around...'cause of the smiley.

:wavey:

 

According to the 3.5E SRD, Caster Level IS, indeed, a prerequisite for certain enchantments. EG Flaming Burst requires Caster Level 12. It also lists, ON THE SAME LINE, the spells required, as well as how much they cost etc. Why would they put it on the same line if it meant something different to every other entry on that line?

There's something fishy about that FAQ.

But then, as most of the spells are fairly low level, why require a higher level caster to craft the item than is needed to cast the spell (level required for the Feat notwithstanding)? Maybe something to do with the XP cost?

Someone might have had a re-think.

EDIT - I just read that FAQ entry in full and it's saying that you can create an item even if you are too low level to cast the spell required, as long as someone or something (eg a Sorceror, Bard or a wand) can provide the spell for you during the crafting. But, if you cast the spell yourself, the default casting level is that given (which implies that you have to be that level or have a Sorceror, Bard or a Wand at the required level to cast it for you if you are lower level than that, which implies that YOU have to be the level required if you do it on your own, like in ToEE. Basically, you can craft it, but need someone else to enchant it for you if you aren't the right level.

The FAQ is KAQ.
It belongs in IRAQ
In a dirty brown MAQ.

And in ToEE you can't get someone else to cast the spell, so you have to know it yourself. in any case, the FAQ is talking about Wondrous Items, not weapons.

The real question is why is Icy Burst level 10 but Flaming Burst is level 12? The spells aren't actually cast at any level, the weapons just require the ability to cast the spell in order to power the bonus 1d6 ice or flame damage plus the other powers of the burst.

Is Flame really more Powerful than Ice?



~

 

Yes, I see that. I was editing my post when you posted. The caster level in the FAQ is for Wondrous Items, eg if you are 5th level and want to make something that requires a 4th level spell. So for the weapons, caster level has to be a prerequisite.

But aren't Fire and Ice equally balanced?

~

 

magical bows and magical arrows don't stack

 

Pay attention to the punctuation. The format is Aura; Caster level; Prerequisites; Price, and the semicolons are significant. The caster level with the CL notation is NOT listed as a prerequisite on those or any other magic item entries, it is listed as the caster level. This is more explicit in the books than it is on, say, d20SRD.org; in the books it actually spells out that the prerequisites start AFTER the caster level. But that doesn't make it any less true in the SRD.

Check the Amulet of Natural Armour, for example, for a case where caster level really is a prerequisite.

 

Jeffh has the right of it. Caster Level is listed before the Prerequisites, not as part of them.

The question is about having someone else help you create and item, but the answer is more general.

Note that it specifically points out that the CL listing for items is not a prerequisite.

 

Where does it say that? I didn't realise they had column headings:

Strong evocation;
CL 12th;
Craft Magic Arms and Armor and flame blade, flame strike, or fireball;
Price +2 bonus.

So the CL is like 2E Wands were cast at 6th level and Rings at 12th level, unless otherwise noted?

Makes some sort of sense.... So it seems I was talking out my butt earlier... Except that you would have to be 12th level to create an item with a CL of 12. If you don't have the spell, you need someone else to cast it for you and possibly make a lower level version.

So if an item you find in a Trove is CL 7 and you create one when you are a Wiz 13, what is the CL of the item? 7 or 13?


~

 

The caster level of an item you make as a 13th level Wizard is 13, unless specified otherwise. For example, scrolls and wands are usually made at the lowest caster level possible to cast the spell in question - because they are priced that way in the DMG. You could certainly craft such items with a higher caster level (and several wands in the DMG are priced exactly that way).

But for permanent items, the listed CL is the CL of randmoly found treasure. The CL of an item you create is your CL at the time of creation. This isn't such a big deal, because it normally only applies if you are subject to a dispel magic spell (or similar effect) in which the item has to make an opposed caster level check to avoid having it's powers suppressed.

Some items, like cloaks of resistance, amulets of natural armor, and rings of protection have explicit limitations listed in their prerequisites section concerning the minimum level necessary to craft those items. For other items, the listed caster level is just an example, and not a prerequisite.

 

Check under the heading "Magic Item Descriptions".

 

I have had some difficulty finding masterwork bucklers though... Am I alone on this?

 

If you ask Brother Smyth about masterwork items and complete his quest, you should be able to buy masterwork bucklers. Remember, the masterwork stuff is only accessible through the masterwork item dialogue option, not through his regular inventory.

 

Yeah, I have completed the Giant's Head quest and bought quite a few mw items via the standard dialogue shopping interface. Somehow I must have missed the buckler then. It would be under armor/shields, right?