Modding Existing Classes?

Hey!

I've been browsing this forum for a while and love the Co8 patch and all, and decided to signup to post. I was wondering, is it possible to mod the existing classes (eg sorcerer) and, say, add feats, special abilities, change the base attack bonus (ie make my sorcerer get an extra attack bonus each level - like a fighter - instead of every 1/3 or something), edit spells and how many spells you could pick (say, we want a barbarian able to cast sorcerer spells and advance sorcerer level, or we want a sorcerer able to learn all spells for every spell-level - instead of just one level five spell - and we want, perhaps, to be able to cast more spells per day), or perhaps we want our rogue to be both a spell caster using both wizard and cleric at the same time, etc (so that a level 10 rogue would have the spell casting abilities of a level 10 wizard and a level 10 cleric). I think you get the picture. Is this possible? I remember in Neverwinter Nights you could easily change a sorcerer's base attack bonus table into a fighter's etc. I'd reallly like some advice in these matters. Thanks!

krille

Edit: Yes, I'd also like to be able to modify skill points you get per level, class skills, feats (both "free" and how many you can choose yourself) etc etc.

Is there any way to add feats to your character btw? I was checking out Ferro's character editor and saw you could add feats there, but read in the modding tutorial/guide that Ferro's was a beta and unstable and would ruin your character and stuff. Thanks again!

 

All skill points, attribute points and feats I (think) I can hack manually using memory editors (such as ArtMoney) and hex editors (such as HexEdit) myself.

But when it comes to spells, or how many spells a sorcerer can learn per spell level (spells per day can always be buffed via buffed charisma) and perhaps multiple different spell classes (wiz, sorc, druid etc) and base attack bonus I'm very interested in. Is it possible to edit this (especially learning all spells for every level + the base attack bonus per level of a fighter)? Just a Yes/No would make me very happy, since if not, I guess I will have to live without it.

This is what I want: A Sorcerer, but still capable fighter, like the old good Kensai Mage!


Thanks very much!

 

to gain more skill points I addjust my intelligence - I needed 34 skill points so I uped my int for one level up to 68 then lowered it again after leveling. I do the same sort of thing with my sorcerer to get more spells perday - up the charisma really high.

I personally would like a mage slayer type fighter you know the kind - spell resistant, can't use magic items.

 

Thanks for the resposne Cujo!

Yeah, exactly. But as I said above, skill points and spells per day aren't really my main concerns. Rather, how many spells I can learn for each spell level (I'd want all fifth level spells for my sorcerer, instead of just one) and the base attack bonus (I want them extra attacks, a stat boost won't provide extra attacks). Hit die would be interesting too, however, I could always increase the consitution and the same (stat increases) would go for mostpart of the above.

Only problem with stat increases are that they may change other things as well, such as, Con not only affects HP but also fortitude saves, a great Cha would certainly give you lots of spells per day, but also your ability to turn/rebuke would be almost unlimited and way overpowered, as goes for Heal skill and Paladin's heal thingy. Increase your Wis alot and you'll save every Will save although you just wanted them spells, etc. So this isn't perfect, it has its sideeffects and drawbacks. Will work till I get to know a better method though.

Yet, even if you get them 34 skill points, in a cross-class skill, you still would only have half the level you would in a class skill, this ain't a major concern either though, since I could (upon character creation) simply buff all the "annoying" skills (such as appraise, persuade, disable devices, etc... those skills that aren't really that combat oriented, they just restrict you from that additional dialogue option or "spotting" (rather searching and finding) that secret, if you know what I mean). But, for say, Tumble and Discipline, that if you set them to 100, your character would be WAYYYY overpowered, but if you didn't, you would have to settle with only half of the skill level of a warrior type. That's why I'm interested in modifying my class-skills, etc.

The "solution" for Feats seem to be either above mentioned character editor or through the constole. Btw, does it or does it not corrupt your character files using Ferro's character editor to add feats to your character?
I found that whenever I tried to modify my skill levels using Ferro's it would corrupt my save file crashing both ToEE and Ferro's. But adding feats (using 0.7 or unofficial 0.8beta) doesn't seem to corrupt it? At least I can start a new game using it?

Thanks a lot for any help in above matters!

The stuff written in bold/italic is most important to me. Thanks!

 

my experience using a character editor was to give feats with forthought eg don't give delect arrows and combat reflexes to your monk cos they'll never get past level 2 that way, only give feats that that class could use eg no martial weapon prof - all for clerics, it doesn't like that, you have to boost your intelligence to make it not crash when giving out the extra skill points - I tryed once and it crashed, the second time I figured out what my int would have to be to have that many skill points and changed both.

you can't add feats in game eg through the console.
a sorcerer can't learn a wider range of spells just cast more.
a wizard can learn more spells but I don't think can memorise more.
can't change BAB

 

Thanks again for the quick replies Allyx and Cujo!

That's some solid answers I was looking for.

Allyx, Well, yeah, I would like some more arcane spells but for a sorc!! (just gotta luv them sorc... never liked the whole memorizing concept you know...endured it in BG2 just for the Kensai). Guess I will have to live with the situation then.


Cujo, Too bad about not being able to add feats in game through console, thought I read something about some "add feat" (well, sort of) console command on the forums, might have been me not reading correctly. Very well... Perhaps a Wiz 10 / Sorc 10 multi-class? lol

Sorry to hear about BAB, there my Fighting Sorcerer plans went into the ocean. Damn, I loved that about NWN. Very well, perhaps I could do a multi-class with the level 20 mod (say a Monk/Sorcerer or something, that wis modifier to AC definitely wouldn't hurt!).

About feats in Ferro's character edtiro:
1. So, you're saying the feature *works*, but you need to be careful and add with caution?

2a. Only add "legal" feats, that would otherwise have been available to you (to select from that list)?
2b. What about adding feats that will be legal in the future, say, I don't have quite the level for a certain feat, but when I get to that level I wanna have it. Could I add it during character creation, and then it'll show up when I reach the level? Or will it just be 'illegal' and not work at all?
2c. Didn't really get that about Clerics and weapon proficencis, could you explain further, please? Thanks!

3. What happens if I add "illegal" feats (such as giving a sorcerer Weapon Specialization...that really requires level 4 fighter, or what about Creature and NPC specific feats, saw some feats I've never heard of listed in that Ferro's editor...they certainly weren't in the manual or in my feat selection lsit), any idea about this?

4. All yellow slots during level-up must get filled for successful level-up, otherwise you can't get past feat selecting, correct? So, I can't select BOTH deflect arrows AND combat expertise upon creating the Monk. BUT, I could pick either ONE of them in Ferro's and then add the other upon gaining level two and picking that one as the 'yellow' slot, right?

5. Must all white slots be filled (good to know, although you could always leave skill focus feats and such for filling the stuff)?

About skills:
6. Are you sure you can just use, say ArtMoney, to just hex edit your skills (and skill points). This is very much possible in BG2, NWN, IWD and any other D&D game I've played so far, and I thought I remembered it could be done just as easily in ToEE, could be wrong though)? (Will check up on this myself tomorrow, still would appreciate an answer from you more experienced guys very much.)

7. Where can I find info about what happens past level 10? Will there be additional feats or something, never got beyond level 10 yet with the level 20 cap patch. Any (un)official documentation on this?

Thanks a lot!!

 

About feats in Ferro's character edtiro:

Yes.

I'm pretty sure you can add feats that will be legal in the future - but here's how to tell, backup your ToEEPC file, make the changes and then save - I've found that if it saves first time then it will work, if it doesn't save (and crashes) then its one of those things that won't work. About the cleric - I tryed giving martial weapon profincy all to my cleric - its a barbarian, fighter, paladin and ranger feat - it doesn't work. make sure you don't give feats that you have to pick later - eg give your rogue all his level 10 feats except one and when you get to level 10 there is only one left to choose and you must choose that one.

some feats aren't in the game or do nothing, I only pick feats that are in the hand book, some of those feats are class or race specfic eg elf weapon prof so won't work and cause crashes.

Yes and Yes - fighters are ok cos you can just keep on focusing a different weapon to get around running out of feats but as I said in some cases you don't have a choice.

you can't not chose to gain a feat or skills at level up.

you can hex your skills but this way is easier - and just use the console to lower your intelligence again at the start of the game (remember not to over do it as you have to spend some skill points during the game).

there are additional feats and such, not all classes can get to level 20 tho even with the max level sat at 20. they run out of spells or feats they can pick. Maybe we should make a list of Current Max Class Levels.

 

I have never found a feat I can't add with Feros', but sometimes it takes several tries. My current Rogue and Bard both have Marital Weapons Proficiency - All, and I added Improved Turning to a fighter I planned later to make a cleric. The trick with adding feats is to do it slowly. Add no more than two feats, save, back up the file, and repeat. If the character file gets corrupted, restore the back up and try again (but keep a copy of the backup file - sometimes it takes several tries before the editor will successfully add feats without corrupting the file). Even with this approach, you will eventually hit a wall where the character file will always be corrupted if you try to add more feats, but so far I have been able to add 10 feats successfully, with no in game consequences.

 

Cujo, thanks again for the long answer. Cerulean the Blue, thanks on the Fero's advice.

First of all, I think I now understand what the feat adding in Fero's really means and what it could do, which I'm happy for.

On the skills, I just tested, and you can give yourself unlimited skill points (on character creation) without modifying your Int. This is how it's done: Instead of searching for the points you have left using the memory editor of your choice (I like ArtMoney), you search for how many points you've spent. Say I upped three skills and now have 5/8 skill points left, don't search for 5, search for 3. And then change skills and sieve and do all that, and finally you come up with the used skill points value (an integer, 4 bytes iirc). Then just freeze this one at 0 and you'll be able to spend as many points as you wish (although, max four points in a single skill of course during character creation). Make sure to change this value to 8 or whatever max skill points you may use, when you're done spending skill points, since otherwise you won't be able to move on in character creation. There you have your skill points! (Haven't tried, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could quite easily come up with a permanent pointer to this value so you won't have to redo all the searching each time).

Now, if you'd rather want, say, 40 skill points in every skill on character creation, this is very much possible. Just raise all skills to one (search), then change all skill points again (say, change them all to two, now sieve) and keep doing the sieving, till you come up with a nice series of 20 values in a row (all 4 byte integers, so really, you could just search for a sequence of 4 byte integers), each being the skill level of one specific skill. Just change these as you want, and use first method (above) to make sure all skill points are spent.

There you have it, your character with, say, 40 skill points in every skill from start. Now you'll be bale to pick those pockets, converse those dialogue options and disable that darn trap. Enjoy!


---


Now, on to a more general question, quite off topic, but still important (for me), is there any reason at all to spend more than 10 levels in a sorcerer? Does anything 'good' come out of it (traditionally you get more spells etc), or is it just a waste of levels?

Thanks very much!

 

Ok, just checked out max level on sorcerer. It's level 14, because at level 15 you get your second level 7th spell and there is only one in the list from where you can pick. So ultimately, level 14 is max level and on level 14 you have:
* All cantrips
* Five 1st-level
* Five 2nd-level
* Four 3rd-level
* Three 5th-level
* Two 6th-level
* One 7th-level

The 7th-level spell is finger of death btw... Gonna try it out now.


Concerning feats, seems like you can just pick "Tougness" again and again as every extra "white" feat.


I was wondering, which of the following 6th level spells are the best:
* Chain Lightning
* Disintegrate
* Greater Heroism (<-- could perhaps be good if I the rest of the levels are spent as warrior class)
* True Seeing

thansk!

 

That's correct per the rules. Toughness is one of a small handful of feats that can be taken multiple times.

 

Which problems would it solve? I know there's a problem leveling rogues up beyond 11th level, but IME its because none of the feats show up as bonus feats, rather than because there's not enough of them. (The 10th level + rogue special bonus ability is supposed to allow them to pick any feat they qualify for, or one of the special rogue abilities, their choice. But after 10th level none of the feats abilities come up gold on the level-up screen, which is where the problem starts.)