Unclear on certain mechanics.

I haven't played ToEE in a while, and even when I did, I didn't play all that much of it. That said, I hope I can find a bit of clarification on some things here.

First off! Defensive Casting. I don't know if this is some kind of bug or what, but twice now when I've tried to use this to avoid an AoO, my Wizard wound up being 'interrupted' by archers. I guess they were set as "ready vs. spell" or whatever? Anyway, the game had my Wizard spammed with "action interrupted" for several times over the number of archers there were until she eventually failed her concentration check and lost the spell. Am I missing something here, or again, was that a bug?

Another thing I really don't understand is how multiple attacks work. My Paladin has 2 attacks per round, 3 with haste. I'm able to kill a target with one attack, Cleave to hit another target, but then my Paladin isn't able to use his second and third attack in that round on the second target? He turns back to the downed enemy and hits them to -10. Anyway around this? I've tried just using the "single attack", but he can't do anything more after that save for moving.

Lastly, and somewhat tied to the second question... I had one enemy attempt to trip my Wizard. He failed and I won the counter trip, tripping the NPC. The next turn, that NPC was able to stand up, perform a trip attack, and then perform a regular attack on my Wizard. All in one round. The above, regarding my Paladin, seems like this character shouldn't have been able to do a trip and then attack afterward - and furthermore, I thought that rising from prone counted as your standard action? I know whenever my party is knocked down, they can't do anything but move on their following turn.

Uh.... that's it, I guess. A lot of this is probably just me being unfamiliar with the finer points of the rules, but it all happened in one fight, and before that encounter I hadn't been having much trouble with things.

Oh! Another thing, actually. Just came to mind: How the heck do I do a ranged sneak attack? I manage it the rare time I get the drop on a group and they're all flat-footed, obviously, and when I fire from invisibility. But I can't for the life of me seem to flank. I'll have my Paladin, two summoned bears and my Cleric all in melee with the same target and they still don't count as flanked. And yes, I'll have the characters on different sides of their target. A part of me wonders if it's because the longspear I gave my cleric - maybe they can't flank a target with a reach weapon - but then... there are the bears, too. Help! So far my Rogue is complete deadweight and my Druid is nothing but a summonbot.

 

You're right about flank, can't flank with a reach or ranged weapon.

If your rogue is using a bow he must be within 30 ft of his target to benefit from sneak attack.

What can be cool, is if you have a foe flanked by two others of your team and then the rogue with point blank shot and precise shot hits him for a high level sneak attack!

On the multiple attacks, instead single attack try full attack, with full attack you'll be able to finish your attacks per round after you've downed the one and even if you have Cleve and didn't kill the one you hit with your Cleve attack you can hit him again if you want.

And welcome to the forum Orange!

 

Thanks for the reply and the welcome!

My experience with "Full Attack" so far has been that my character with KO a target, Cleave to another, then go back to kill the first target. Is that to say then that, if the first target were already "Dead" rather than just unconscious after the first attack, I'd go on to use my second attack on the Cleaved target?

Sorry if I've worded that incomprehensibly.

 

Heh heh.

OK, your Pally has three attacks per round, from the radial dial you choose "Full Attack" you will see your curser turn into an attack icon with a 3 on it.

You attack the foe in front of you once and the attack icon now shows a 2, you click on him again attacking and you kill him, then your Pally cleves and hits the guy to your right, you still have an attack left which you can then hit that guy that got cleved if you want.

Full attack can almost be like Whirlwind Attack except that your secondary attacks come at a lower BAB.

 

I've had problems with Full Attack, at least when it's hotkeyed-- I hit it, click my target, and my action bar empties out without any swinging. Clicking again just causes a single attack + turn end.

 

Options > Preferences > "End turn with time remaining" > Never
&
Uncheck "End turn after default action"

 

Hi Sirchet, very helpful reply. I didn't know that. Very often lost an attack because character turned back to an already dead opponent. I think your post is ideal for the: "I didn't know I could do X until now" thread. (I think worth to become sticky anyway)

 

1) About "spreading ou" your multple attacks:

When you just point & click your target, your character will spend all of his attacks blindly on the designated target, with only a cleave (or great cleave if you have it and the foes are brittle little goblins) to deter from his singlemindedness. ...Don't you guys dare to think about great cleavage, you perverts
Anyhow, if your character still has an attack and the original foe is knocked out but not dead yet, he will use his remaining attacks to finish him off.

Now, if you use the full attack in the radial menu, you will be able to choose as many targets as you've got attacks... but sometimes, you find yourself 5 foot short of your next target. Which is no problem at all, as the 5-foot step (in the radial menu under movement) is considered a free action, and thus can still be done - even in the middle of your full attack.

Offcourse, if you got the quick draw feet, you could whip out your bow & still shoot an arrow towards one of your foes who's standing at the other side of the battlefield.

2) About getting up & the remaining options:

Your character will use 1 move action to get up from prone - and will always do that. But as per p&p rules, you have 1 move & 1 a "other" action in a round. That "other" one, you can use it to either move again, use an object or do an attack. So when your character gets up, he can still dish out some vengeance if he's close enough to the target he wants to attack.

3) About defensive casting:

Defensive casting only helps against AoO's, not against enemies who've set themselves in "ready vs spell" - as that's not an AoO.

4) Aboot ranged sneakatt etc:

First, you can't sneakattack if you're further away as 30ft. And while you can't flank witha ranged weapon (sling,bow or x-bow), you can fank & sneak with a reach weapon. One of the main reasons why my rogue(s) always carry a longspear on them.

To get back your sneak attack on a ranged att, you have to become either invisible, hidden (Horn of fog you find in Brother smith's chest - for example), or you should blind your chosen targets (the Glitterdust spell for example will do that to your enemies if they fail their save)

 

You can't flank with a reach weapon unless the reach weapon carrying character is in an adjacent spot to the foe you want to flank, if he's reach weapon distance away it is not a flank.

 

This is about the ranged sneak attack- as has been pointed out you need to be within 30 ft of your target to perform it. Feats to focus on would be Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot, and if you want to kill an ettin in a single round add Rapid Shot and Crippling Strike- your fighters will have only mop up duty after that... P.S. make sure to visit the Hommlett cabinet maker- he sells masterwork missile weapons after someone helps the town woodcutter with a spider problem...

 

I'm pretty sure I got my sneak attacks with reach weapons, while not adjecent to the target.

F-0-E-0-R works as a flank, if the (F)ighter has a reach weapon too - or does not have one, but is enlarged and thus gaining reach.

0 = empty
E = Enemy
R = rogue

Which is normal, because this is what the SRD20 says about flanking:

Ah, about the trip attacks... If you have improved trip (which quite some bugbears do have), a trip attempt is always followed up by an attack. Hence why they can get up, trip target again and do an attack.

 

As nyarlothotep says, there is something of an art tu using full attack. I always assign a hotkey to it and 5 foot step, as you often use them in combination. It is perfectly possible to carry out a range of options once you have started a full attack, and this is easiest achieved with hotkeys - you can attack, move 5 feet, smite evil, change weapons (with quick draw), shoot, throw, feint or trip in any combination, each with cleave possibilities. It's worth noting that a hotkey for trip is not reliable, so you always need to select that one from the radial menu whilst in a full attack cycle. Throwing weapons as part of a full attack is also a good tactic, particularly short range ones like cleavers, and combined with 5 foot steps you can position yourself for cleaving, attacks of opportunity or setting yourself up for whirlwind attack next round. Also useful is to have reach and close weapons and switch as needed, or different weapons for different foes (or change ammo). For maximum benefit you need quick draw.

 

For an example; a paladin with 3 attacks, quick draw and improved trip against a ghast.

Assign a hotkey to full attack; press control+the hotkey whilst hovering over the radial menu: ctrl-X for example assigns x.

1. Press x, icon changes to 3.
2. Hover over ghast and select smite evil. After attack becomes a 2.
3. Select improved trip from the radial menu for attacks 2 and 3.
4a. If I trip the ghast I stay next to him as I deal more damage up close and I want to hit him when he gets up.
4b. If I trip myself up, I am still able to execute my third attack from the floor but can't move.
4c. If I don't trip him, I switch to glaive and 5 foot step away, reducing his number of attacks but maximising my AoOs.

Hope the example helps.

 

Yes, I think you may have misunderstood my statement.
Your rogue benefitted from a flank because one of your team members was adjacent to the foe, but if your team mate that is adjacent to the foe attacks he will not get a flanking bonus because your rogue is using a ranged weapon, same goes for a reach weapon unless the wielder of it is adjacent to the foe.

There is a rarely used feat, (Ranged Flanking) that allows a fighter with a ranged weapon to give a flanking bonus with his ranged weapon, he's treated as if he was in melee adjacent to the foe because he is able to keep the foe's attention on him thus removing the dex bonus when attacked by another member, but we won't drag that into this.

 

Plus, it is a feat that's not even incorporated in ToEE... As far as I know, it's not even part of the basic 3.5ed feats.

Just to be absolutely perfectly clear:

flanking with non-reach mele weapons : works
Flanking with mixed reach & non-reach weapons : works
flanking with reach weapons: works
flanking with melee (reach or non-reach) weapon at one side & ranged weapons at the other: fails