Things to do, places to go, people to see....

Discussion in 'General Modification' started by Zebedee, Feb 23, 2008.

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  1. Zebedee

    Zebedee Veteran Member Veteran

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    Actually just things to do. Bugs and scripting which need doing but don't touch upon the rebalancing project:

    1) Lareth encounter. The scripting indicates that this should be a more complex encounter than just 'beat up the cleric'.

    2) The jailer/turnkey in the Temple who offers to surrender but doesn't because his bugbear guard sets off combat.

    3) Bandits in Temple. Better resolution once leader offers to surrender?

    4) Mickey's entire scenario could use some fixing. Frequent lengthy trips to Nulb and back, his apparent ability to intimidate anybody but the PCs, etc.

    5) Lubash battle: should lubash talk even if party is not wearing a cloak?

    6) Moathouse gnoll battle: the gnolls in the back room still don't always enter combat properly.

    7) Spugnoir's ingame dialogue needs checking to see if it works properly. - Fixed by Ted

    8) Re-checking Verbobonc references now that it can be reached via map. eg in temple.

    9) 2 Nulb Villagers who stand around in combat mode when things go wrong in Tolub encounter. Have them run off or something?

    Weapon descriptions which are wrong:
    hand crossbow




    What else in the way of fixable bugs needs doing?
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2008
  2. Half Knight

    Half Knight Gibbering Mouther

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    Indeed. There must be something else. Or if it's not too much trouble, add soem detail.
    Seeing the "hidden" lloth signal outside the Moathouse, the mention of "Lloth's guests" in the book, and the gun seller/Verbobonc encounters, is it posible to add something else to the plot? If someone it's still wearing some item from Lareth or something like that?

    If it's not too much trouble, and you are willing, if you need protos, dlgs or artwork, it's easy to do, so just ask :)
     
  3. Zebedee

    Zebedee Veteran Member Veteran

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    The scripting I was talking about revolves around the alarm being sounded for entering combat with the sergeant in the corridor. This should bring Lareth out of his room to a position somewhere behind the safety of his men in the main antechamber.

    The only thing which I know of which references back to something Lareth is wearing is the whole Ramos and Gremag assassin thing. There could be other things hidden elsewhere in the dialogue and scripting though. There's an awful lot hidden away behind the scenes which could be (re-)activated.

    To be honest, I was just hoping to have a nice list for those of us who can script etc. to dip into for easy little jobs while KotB and/or RL relax enough for us to get back into more arduous modding work ;)
     
  4. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    Remember that the predominant opinion in earlier discussions was that Lareth had to remain isolated so that he could do the whole stop combat/maybe join the party thing later. I believe Ted's added Spiders were an attempt to help him out during his own battle - after/if you turn him down.

    One simple thing I would suggest for Lareth is to make him initiate angry dialogue with the party when you enter his chambers (if you fought his gang outside), rather than having him standing there filing his nails.
     
  5. Allyx

    Allyx Master Crafter Global Moderator Supporter

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    I've PM'ed Old Book about expanding Lareths plot, I have done some work on Lareth already for TotWC, most of it working as it should (at least until someone finds a way to break it).

    As far as scripting tasks that need doing, one that has annoyed me is the "blue cirlcle" NPC's, ones that run_off before being dismissed from the party, or the all_run_off Illikan's party (and possibly a few others) inflicts on parties whodon't kill him and loot his carcass.
     
  6. Zebedee

    Zebedee Veteran Member Veteran

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    Or the other option would be for him to dismiss his gang which is how other combat where there are other protagonists have to be handled? (eg gnoll leader, bandit leader in temple and jailer in temple).

    The Spiders add a bit more complexity but they don't really help lareth out - it's still a 'beat the cleric' fight rather than a memorable end of act encounter. Ideally, we could move the spiders to when Lareth decides to turn on the party but has no allies close by?
     
  7. Old Book

    Old Book Established Member

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    I can do the dialog, and am looking through NPC dialogs now. However, my ability to script is currently nil. I was thinking more about having him become an active adviser on your raids deep into the temple after you free him from Burne. In the re-balancing project, his goal of claiming the now empty temple in the name of Lolth can then move to the fore, possibly even allowing a Temple-Respawn at the end of the other rebalanced encounters. :)

    That also helps tie him in more with Verbo-mod; the Verbo-Drow become active agents of Lloth, allies in Lareth's attempt to get Lloth's new temple up and running. If Lareth is dead, the Verbo-Drow can still have a renewed Temple as a goal.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2008
  8. Half Knight

    Half Knight Gibbering Mouther

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    now that you've asked for bugs, i usually have the spider encounter later: after defeating Lareth, looting and all, when i went to the back exit (where the big three encounter happens) the spiders suddendly appear there, really annoying since it's a corridor.

    I uasually have one character slipping thru bluffing, and start the fight "face to face" with Lareth, with the bluffing PC confronting him, and the others the rest of the goons; but if the fight it's started from the initial guardsman, when Lareth it's confronted, it's alone...

    could it be done that he summons the spiders the first round, if he is alone against a full party?
     
  9. Zebedee

    Zebedee Veteran Member Veteran

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    That's how the spiders are meant to work. And that's also how the bluffing is meant to work as well - you bluff one guy through, but if you can't bluff well enough, the bluffer ends up in a lot of trouble.

    The spiders can be triggered whenever really. We just need to have a look at what is possible to script and how we see the encounter playing out.

    As Allyx and Gaear said, the hard part is stopping the combat once Lareth offers to surrender. I think there is a way around that by having the guards run off (be dismissed by Lareth). But it's what people think is best. That same solution is probably the way to solve all three of the scripting tasks in the OP.

    The scripting and dialogue suggests that Lareth should not be fought alone, but that Troika also had difficulty with getting things to work.

    We could probably have a discussion about this in a thread devoted to the issue. My next job is to go through the bug reporting thread for those little jobs which no-one has got round to doing and put them in a neat list so they can be ticked off once done. There's a fair few which just involve changing descriptions etc. and no scripting.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2008
  10. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    Almost forgot -

    • as was briefly discussed in the CMF thread, Mickey's entire scenario could use some fixing. Frequent lengthy trips to Nulb and back, his apparent ability to intimidate anybody but the PCs, etc.
    Also from CMF -

    • Lubash battle: Lubash still goes KOS the moment I appear. He has never done anything different in my games.
    • Moathouse gnoll battle: all the gnolls still don't join in the fun at once. Makes the battle a bit more simplistic than it should be, I think.
    Newly observed:

    • Turnkey on Temple Level 1 doesn't bother talking, goes straight to fighting.
    I think that if we can't figure out a reliable way to get these guys to talk in complicated fashion, then we should just do it in simple fashion, i.e., have them set to talk to everybody all the time and then initiate combat from dialogue or something like that. The little story that ToEE has to offer in the temple comes from talking to NPCs, as inane as their conversation may sometimes be, so to miss even that is a real drag and just furthers the slugfest play-by-rote feel of the whole thing. Seriously.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2008
  11. Half Knight

    Half Knight Gibbering Mouther

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    Really?
    I thougth that he summoned the spiders to help him (i've got that when he shouts "Lolth help me" or something like that) and they usually appear behind my characters (since they are facing Lareth, i got flanked), which make sense... but appearing like 10 minutes later, in another place...dunno...

    And yes, i know the bluff works ok. I use that option cos i think it's more honorable. :)

    Yup. Weapons descriptions, for example, there's a good bunch of them wrong (i recall the Jiang, the hand crossbow for example), and damage should be fixed too (i was going to do a look at that, but i'm really busy atm)

    That's true...i never see the dialogs of the encounter with Senshock, Deggum and the other as they usually attack me on sight, and yet they have great dialogues and even a quest
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2008
  12. Zebedee

    Zebedee Veteran Member Veteran

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    There are two sets of spiders. I'd imagine you'd only usually see the two by Lareth first. The other two are a bit of a nasty surprise coming out.
     
  13. Gaear

    Gaear Bastard Maestro Administrator

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    The Verbobonc aspects of the prisoners on Temple Level 1 are still rather wacky - able to offer trips to Verbobonc out of the Blue, talking about things you shouldn't know yet, etc. Maybe this would be something for OB to give a thorough once-over.
     
  14. Old Book

    Old Book Established Member

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    When I can.
     
  15. Half Knight

    Half Knight Gibbering Mouther

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    Aaah, i see, now that have sense.

    But they appear in group, not separated (three small, one big ), either when called in battle, or non at all and appear later (the four of them), that's the annoying since it gets messy to click something accurately (in the corridor everyone gets on top of everyone).

    I never had two small encounters, always a big pack, summoned in battle, or out of nowhere a long time later.
    Meh, nevermind.


    Other thing: in Nulb, if things get messy with Tolub, everyone joins (but sometimes, straight bertram runs screaming and not join), the two villagers in the bar don't do nothing, they just stand there begging for mercy but engaged in combat mode and it's not posible to finish combat without killing them, even when they don't attack.
     
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