new party

Discussion in 'The Temple of Elemental Evil' started by Templar, Dec 7, 2008.

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  1. Templar

    Templar Established Member

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    Originally my first ToEE party was two warriors, cleric, rogue and a mage. One of my warriors was a dwarf specializing in axe and I had troubles getting a good axe. Where are the opinions?

    It's been a while since I played and need to be humble and ask for party suggestions .

    I don't want to be too powerful but I don't want a weeny party either. :poke:

    My party will either be neutral good or chaotic good based. I want at least one warrior, one who has bastard sword specialty, (I like the Fragnach, or however you spell it.) And I'm wondering should I have a fighter lvl 2/duel to rogue.

    Any thoughts on 5 ?
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2008
  2. GuardianAngel82

    GuardianAngel82 Senior Member

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    The options are now at the very top on the tool bar under "options". I couldn't find them either. ;)

    I think you should experiment. I like elf rogue/ranger and 1/2orc druid/barbarian. Since powerful longswords are available, you should consider a cleric of Hieronemous or Corellon Larethian with war specialty.

    Early on, the powerful weapons are a +1 holy longsword, a +1 short sword and Fruella's great cleaver. Calmert has a +1 holy haevy mace and soon has a masterwork silver light mace. The cabinet maker eventually has a lot of masterwork wooden items, and Bing will provide masterwork leather items after he is cured. Better items than these are available after clearing the moathouse.
     
  3. Templar

    Templar Established Member

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    Sounds interesting. I hope there is tons of gold so I can buy these things :)

    Please tell me a little more of how you made this ranger/rogue. Did your cleric use the long sword? I'm considering a half-orc to, I thought they were only good as barbarians though. A druid half-orc sounds interesting.

    So far I've made a male and female fighter. The male will use bastard swords (eventually) and female using long swords. I've also made a female elven wizard.

    I'm going to try the elven rogue/ranger I just need more info.

    This leaves one slot. I will probably make a cleric based on war and what not.

    What are you guys using as your front line hitters (melee) ?

    what are masterwork 'wooden' items good against? Does wooden items have a special advantage on certain enemies? Thanks
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2008
  4. blackwind

    blackwind Established Member

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    What did you need to know about a rogue/ranger?

    I generally make my PC's based on actual PC's I played in pnp d&d.

    Most of my front liners are generally barabarians and fighters. I tend to have at least one of them with power attack, cleave and great cleave. I know most people probably don't think rangers make decent front liners. Since I tend to favor them you cand make them capable frontliners especially if you multiclass them in to fighters to get extra feats. Usually, I pick up the weapon specialization feats. But that's just me.

    The mod pack pretty much gives you every weapon available in the game. As soon as you do the quest for brother Smythe gives you masterwork versions of practically every weapon. Those you don't find with him Ah Fong will have it. So you should be able to find an ax or whatver you are looking for.

    For the last slot a fighter/rogue can do nicely. If you can get him to flank an enemy he can get in some sneak attack damage:yes: Personally I like bards as my fifth class. They can heal, provide some buffing spells and make great frontman for a party.

    Wooden items don't get bonuses against enemies I believe. They are there for style. Plus druids I know can't equip metal armor/shields. So they have the same items available to them as clerics do. Well non-metal versions at any rate.

    Hope this helps some.
     
  5. Templar

    Templar Established Member

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    The ranger/rogue: Is he meaning a multi-class or a duel class. If duel class when do I duel to a rogue? What race?

    I'm considering ditching a fighter for a barbarian as one of the front liners. From what I remember they have rage and other benefits but lack coming with medium or heavy armor proficiencies.

    Anyone have more information on pros/cons of a barbarian over a fighter?

    I'm thinking 2 warriors, a mage, a cleric and a ranger/rogue or fighter/rogue. Don't know if I'm dueling or multi-classing. I need help there.
     
  6. GuardianAngel82

    GuardianAngel82 Senior Member

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    Start out as a rogue, I like elf, but other's are good, then alternate ranger and rogue with each levelup. If you have human, halfling or half-elf, you don't even have to alternate. When at 2nd ranger, chose dual-wield or archery. Both are good. Do fighter/rogue if you want more fight and less stealth.

    Start the 1/2orc as a barbarian or a druid, then levelup either way as you wish. Better fighter than a regular druid, but not as strong of a druid. 1/2orc clerics are good too.

    Clerics of "War" gods who chose war as a domain get specialty in that god's favored weapon at the start. Hero and CoLa have longswords as favored weapons.

    In 3.5, you simply choose your next class at levelup. ;)
     
  7. blackwind

    blackwind Established Member

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    If you want your barbarian to heavy armor you can give him the feat or you can give him one level of fighter. They start out wearing medium armor.

    Barabarians have more health, rage and some other decent class abilities. Specifically they get evasion and they have fast movement if not encumbered. Not sure if you can keep their fast movement in heavy armor. Rage itslef is both good and bad. It gives you a heatl/attack and damage bonus for a number of turns equal to your barbarian level I think. You may need to look that part up. The downside is that they are weaker for the number of turns they are enraged.

    Bottomline is Barbarians can dish out great damage at a cost and roll the highest hp of any class(d12). Fighters get more feats than any other class. A 10th level human fighter has 11 feats. Also, fighters have feats that require fighter levels to get them: greater weapon focus and weapon specialization being the two. Either class make a decent melee character. It really boils down to what you like more.
     
  8. Scryler

    Scryler Night's Wordsmith

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    I'm not an experienced player and am probably the last to make recommendations, so I'll just say what I like for healers: Dwarven Clerics. High Con and can fight.
     
  9. blackwind

    blackwind Established Member

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    Me too:yes: Other than Moradin being the God, who doesn't like the possibility of a drunk cleric.
     
  10. Zalmoxes

    Zalmoxes Forest Guardian

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    My "tank" is usually Ftr 8/Barb x. The big advantage of having a Rog/Rgr PC is the high dex. You can take the Weapon Finesse, TWF at the second Rgr level, give him/her two shortswords and you'll rock!! As about your Cle, sky's the limit. There are so many options, depending on your game style. For instance I prefere Pelor, Sun and Good domains, but you can have Heironeus or Corellon, as said before, if you want a more fighter Cle. Or a Cle of a nature deity(Obad-Hai, Ehlonna) for turning/rebuking plants/animals. And so on.... Dru/Barb is a very good choice, good caster, decent fighter and, arguably, best crafting wondrous items in the game.
     
  11. Templar

    Templar Established Member

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    Clerics of "War" gods who chose war as a domain get specialty in that god's favored weapon at the start. Hero and CoLa have long swords as favored weapons.

    ***
    just feels odd using a blade with a cleric, I'm old school though in that sense :)
    Took me a while but I used an elven mage with a bow, but she couldn't hit squat!

    **********

    So far my party is looking like this:

    Fighter - Human (male)
    (use bastard swords eventually)

    Fighter - Human (female)
    (long swords)

    Wizard - Elven (female)

    Cleric - Dwarf (male)
    (Domain-War) (Hero or Cola as Deity*long swords favored weapon)

    Rogue/Ranger - Elven
    1st level Ranger/then rogue
    (back and forth)

    I'm considering making one of the fighters go barb/fighter switch for at least 1 level of barb or making a barb with a level of druid.
    Not sure yet. Course I could always make a 6 person party and improvise.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2008
  12. Half Knight

    Half Knight Gibbering Mouther

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    @Templar

    Remember:

    Don't waste a feat to use Scather or Fragarach!
    They always hit, so i doesn't matter if you're not proficient. With enough strength, even the wizard can use them.

    A few critics to your party choices:

    ---You don't have a "face" in the party. You need a high level rogue, or better, a bard.
    ---Your party have too many warrior-like guys. Only a fighter is needed. If you have too many melee charcters, you'wont be able to attack a single opponent since they will not have space, what's worst you'll be giving you oppononents cover from your ranged charcters. If you still want two, make one of them specialized in reach weapons (longspear, glaive, etc)
    ---Also, you don't have any charcter covering the nature aspects, only a half-ranger. In your particular party, i would make a ranger/druid or barbarian/druid, and multiclass one of the fighters.
    ---Personally, i wouldn't use a Dwarf as cleric, they have less movement, so if you need to move your cleric (be it to take him out of danger or run to help a fallen comrade) you can have some problems. A half elf bard of CoLa, makes a good cleric: not only gains longsword proficiency, but also has racial bonus to make your cleric a fine "face" party.
    ---An elven wizard is classic, but in practice is a bit useless. It will only have a extra +1 to ranged attacks and AC but less HP and less FOR saving throws (that is the weakest of the wizard). If you make a human, you'll get a better health, and an extra feat to buy either Point blank shot or dodge (which will be more or less the same than the elf racial bonus)

    Don't take it bad! :)
    These are the weaknesses i see in your choices, be sure the engine will go for these too

    You can always "think outside the box" ;) :

    -A dwarf can make great barbarian/ranger.
    -Dwarves make though sorcerers too.
    -A half-orc is a powerful monk.
    -A half orc barbarian/rogue is a killing machine.
    -A halfling or gnome warrior is really effective.
    -A human barbarian/bard have everything that needs.
    -A halfling monk is absolutely resilient.
    -A half-elf paladin has great social skills.
     
  13. Templar

    Templar Established Member

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    I don't take it bad, I appreciate your input a great deal! And your right.

    I'm a little used to brawn, my style of play in BG2, but the deeper more strategic play of ToEE calls for less of that and more smarts. I'm glad you mentioned what you did. I will read the rest of your message and work at reforming my party and taking out some brawn. I haven't really tried a bard, so that looks like a new choice for me in this party.

    Its looking like this now so far:
    Fighter - Human

    Bard- Half Elf
    (God - Cola / gets long sword)

    Wizard - Human
    (feats: point blank shot or dodge)


    Other Ideas:

    - half-orc is a powerful monk.
    - half orc barbarian/rogue is a killing machine.
    - half/elf Ranger/druid.

    what kind of stats should I look at for my bard? Whats most important here? Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2008
  14. blackwind

    blackwind Established Member

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    Clerics can make a decent face for a party. If given the right feats mainly negotiator to boost sense motive.

    I've never had too much of an issue using too many melee type charcters without range.

    Scather/Fragarach does always hit but if you want to do more damage you need weapon focus in bastard sword so you can take the weapon specialization feat. Or if you want use those swords one handed with shield you have to take exotic weapon proficiency.

    Bards need high charisma and decent dex since they can't wear heavier armor. If you plan on using the bard for melee damage rather than an archer he/she will need strength as well. Their casting abilities is directly tied with charisma.
     
  15. Half Knight

    Half Knight Gibbering Mouther

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    Well, in my personal case, a Bard/rogue works wonders.
    Everyone gives him High dexterity, for bows, but i prefer strength: a Bard usually is in the front line to talk, so he gets attacked frecuently. You'll get the "bard kit" early in the game, the elven green chain and the elven shield. Give them to him, as well as a longsword (you can marry meleny, and her father will give you a holy longsword ;) ). I don't like a dual wielding bard, since you won't be able to use shields. Your bard should be a a support/opportunist warrior or caster, not the main combatant. give him two or four levels of rogue for the sneak attack to strengthen their combat skills without losing skill points (the rogue also grant the bard some extra weapon proficiences, as since he has similar skills, you won't be slowed on those.). Get first at least 4 levels of bard before multiclassing with rogue (that's it, if you're going to multiclass at all)

    Be aware, a Bard is a complex class, but if you play well your cards, can kick ass. In my party, he usually does all the work, if there are few opponents.
    For stats, i like to give him:
    Charisma first, followed by strength and intelligence. I pay little attention to constitution, being my last stat. My stats usually look -more or less- like this:
    ST 16 , DEX 16, DEX 10, INT 14, WIS 12, CHA 17. You can use the many buffing spells they have, and raise the stat you feel is weak with the points granted at every 4 lvl.

    For the wizard, bought both: dodge and PBshot (PBshot also applies to ranged spells! ;) ). First survive, learn later. at level 5 -bonus wiz feat- bought spell penetration you're going to need it, and at lvl 6 improved spell penetration. You'll be ready to break easily thru spell resistance. If human, get him a heavy crossbow for great ranged damage.
    Remeber that if you specialize, two other shools become prohibited, the only exception being Divination (it will require to quit only one school). Personally, i like to specialize in Divination and forgo Necromancy, since i find little use for it.

    A monk is a hard class: he's a combatant, so you'll need to be though and also be smart (they need wisdom). If you get a lucky roll (say, all above 12 and at least three above 16), you'll be able to make a deadly monk. Multiclassing with rogue makes them stealthy and deadly... and cool :)
     
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