Getting my ass handed to me

25 point buy seems pretty low to me. I've tried it, and got destroyed by the spiders in the deklo grove. I was just rolling up a neutral evil party with 25 point buy (before the game crashed), and gave them level 2 before even exiting the shop map, and the cleric in the opening scene managed to kill one of my guys before I could take him out.

I did, however, once work out the statistics for 4d6-drop-lowest (which is what the roller uses), and as I recall, on average it comes out to around 25 point buy. Of course, that doesn't count rolling multiple times. Traditional straight 3d6 is even lower, naturally. And in either case, there's always the chance of getting a really crappy or really great roll, the natural tendency to discard the former probably biases such characters above 25 point buy.

NWN2 uses 32 point buy, which feels more comfortable to me (NWN1 used 30 I think, which is also all right). I'd say that seems about the right level for reasonable early level combat, but NWN combat tends to be significantly easier than ToEE, so I'm not sure I can commit to that.

Of course, in ToEE, I find it difficult to resist making my characters supermen.

 

just wanted to say thanks to these posts and tips and CO8!
but dang when i installed the patch (right after cleaning out the moathouse)
and starting over, now that Ogre is sick with his 2handed hits! the old one had
2 one-handed hits much more absorbable. now its total splatsville....
what a great game always loved this module.

 

My biggest gripe isn't the encounters but the way you enter combat. I don't see the point of having formation when 90% of the time my mage in the back ends up leading the party. Also any transition encounter typically puts my squishy characters out in front because obviously I would want them there...

Half the fights are more difficult simply because of this.


Rey~

 

Rey, I agree whole heartedly, now I place my "soft" characters in the middle with my druid's bear way out front. Less headaches when traveling or during the surprise round.

 

Hi Folks
OMG !! Thank you ! Thank You ! Thank You !! I didn't know you could do that !! (The roll, switch to Assign then Drag and Drop). That makes creating a party so much easier. Last night I was trying to create a new party and it took FOREVER to create my Elf Rogue ( he needs good DEX, CON, INT, and CHA plus halfway decent ST and W scores ). I finally gave up on rolling characters at about 1 AM. I personally think that 72/73 is to low for v3.5 DnD. It was ok in version one AD&D because you didn't have bugbears tripping you, and Ogres doing 30 HP of damage in a single hit. If you looked at the stats for some of the characters, their stats weren't that remarkable. IIRC Elmo probably had the highest stats of all the NPCs in Hommlet, and that was because he was a Ranger, and in the 1st Ed. AD&D, Rangers had to have something along the lines of S, I, W, and Con all 14 or higher ( I don't remember the exact requirements, but I do remember that Rangers had one of the highest stat requirements of any class ). I don't think Burne and Rufus had a single 18 stat between the two of them, but I could be wrong. Consider the original ToEE, there were no "quests" in Hommlet, the Deklo Grove did not exist, and Emridy Meadow, was just a place mentioned in passing during the Dungeon Master's prologue. A first level party could go to the moathouse and have a decent chance of clearing the upper level before having to return to town for a rest and refit. With the 3.5 rules, a 1st level party should be allowed to go to the moathouse only after spending several months being brainwashed at a madrassa and being equipped with suicide vests ( ones filled with explosives ). GA, I think your group from the 70's had it pretty close, especially seeing as any stat below 15 had the same bonus as an 11 in 3.5 rules. Adventurers are supposed to be above average, not the average guy sweeping the streets somewhere.
Now that I know how to "modify" the character creation process, I won't have to spend forever rolling and re-rolling and re-re-rolling characters until I get some decent stats. To keep it interesting (aka somewhat challenging) The way I will roll characters is to take the first roll I get ( unless its mostly 8's or lower ) and modify the numbers and go from there. Do I think it's cheating ?? Hell no !! It's just evening out the playing field. The simple fact is that ToEE was originally designed and created for v1.0 D&D rules, and things have changed a lot since then. The monsters have gotten tougher (Lubash can wipe out a 3rd level party if things go wrong, where in v1.0 a first level party could take him if they were reasonably careful), but the character creation hasn't "kept up with the times".
Thanks again for the info.
TRC

 

No prob 13Fox, glad I can help. The trick will be figuring out how far below straight 18's you are willing to go.

I like to take tabletop pregenerated pc's or the prerolled characters in this game (mostly 73 point total stat's) and increase each stat by 2. I'll also change other things like lose Eberk/Dothal's warhammer or reallocate points from the unnecessarily high charismas.

Another trick is to roll a character and change one stat. Or as many stats as it takes to total 78, 84 or 90. Maybe more for Bards or non-synergistic dual-class. (not "duel") Or make a first-level Drizzt Do Urdan.

I wish we could increase the point-buy points allotment to 36 or so. Straight 18 stat PC are BORING. :shrug:

 

I dunno, I just roll until I get close to what I want. IMHO having stats too high makes the game too easy after you hit level 5 or so. Having played the game for years, I don't think I need a straight-18 or even a straight-16 chara; playing wimps is more fun.

 

Key to success: give your tank 18 str and a good two hander specialization, will make the first few levels much easier.