Slings I think that slings are under powered (1d4) and over accurate. As a kid I played around with one. I tried several lengths and bullet sizes – all packed a big punch. A three foot length (folded) with a rock the size of a goose egg (about a pound?) would certainly knock someone (adult size) down and probably break a bone…..If it hit. With practice I was pretty good throwing rocks, using a wrist rocket (powerful sling shot), shooting hand guns, rifles and bows, but hitting anything smaller than a door at ten yards with a sling was pure luck. I have read two historical accounts on sling use, both about the Roman Auxiliaries- their targets were formations rather than individual soldiers. (Don’t ask for a citation – I can’t remember what I had for lunch) What do you think of this- 1d8, 18-20 x 2 -1 to hit unless point blank shot, racial bonus or target one size larger than human 50% chance of friendly fire when shooting into melee without precise shot. and or different bullet sizes. sound off
You should take a look at Heroes of Battle 3.5 Perhaps the problem is the 50' range increment; maybe it should be reduced to 10'
Well yeah, a sling is quite deadly. yet if you have a shield, a metal or leather (or whatever material) helm and a simple armor like leather, a sling is quite useless. And most of the encounters have a lesser kind of armor. A crossbow bolt for example would penetrate any of the above protections. Agreed, a bullet from a sling is very heavy and could do some harm, but probably will me far easier to be deflected than an arrow. A bullet hitting a shoulder plate from an armor or a helm will probabliby be deflected rather than go through. Even a chainmail, which will not stop the full force of a sling bullet, will probably stop all the deadly strength of it. Would leave an awful bruise, and hurt like hell, tho
HK, I'm not sure you understand the dynamics of blunt weaponry. A mace or hammer isn't going to penetrate a leather helmet or jerkin any more than a sling bullet will, but I wouldn't want to rely on one to keep me from being hurt by that guy swinging a sledgehammer...
The same could be said for darts: I'm told they had them strapped inside their shields, and would just toss them in the air when closing, the weight in the head would make sure they came down point first. Certainly hurt someone's head, but possibly more about disrupting the formation at the crucial moment rather than damage. Its a perfectly valid point but I don't know D&D ever bears thinking about too closely
I didn't deny that, Erk. But there's no way a sling bullet do the same damage to a unarmored guy, than one with even the weaker armor. Even someone wearing many layers of cloth will be protected, for example, a wizard with a robe, cloak, and adventuresr's outfit. The sling bullet simply lacks the weight. A hammer has all their weight, plus the strength/force punch of the wielder. So, for simplicity sake, the rules states a sling as a light damaging weapon. But the boon is that is cheap, light, and (unlike ToEE) you can use it one handed (technically, you can use a crossbow in one hand. Again, ToEE doesn't cover that ) The PnP rpg of Lord of the Rings has an interesting concept, that diferent types of weapons are weak/strong against different armors. Interesting, yes, but not practical. I recall a fight of five of us against only 4 orcs, and we spent the whole night looking thru tables of damage. D&D simplifies that, you can always add house rules (in fact, there are books whit complex combat systems)
Roman slingers were auxiliaries, and had their own formations. They were light infantry, wore little or no armor, and weren't meant to engage in close combat. Those rubber band jobs are not sling shots. They are a form of catapult. They are children's toys, though they can knock down a rabbit. I played with home-made sling shots until I was a teenager, and they are BRUTAL! I had a 10 year friend knock out a car windshield at thirty yards with one. I'd say they were equivalent in accuracy and impact to a .45 ACP. Sling bullets will kill at range. If you think they aren't accurate, you didn't practice enough. They ARE harder to learn than a pistol. Goliath NEVER HAD A CHANCE against David, who if I'm not mistaken, was a soldier when he did that.
IIRC, David was not a soldier, he was just a shepherd who had been "drafted" for the war, and he only volunteered to fight Goliath when all the king's soldiers backed out. HK, a lead musket ball doesn't have much mass, either - but it can do horrendous amounts of damage to a human body. Remember, it's the force that inflicts the damage, and mass is only half the equation. You're right about different types of armor being more effective vs different weapons - a suit of chainmail is much, much more effective vs a slashing bladed weapon than it is vs a mace, for example. In fact, I remember the 2nd Ed. AD&D optional rules for weapon damage vs armor types. They did add more time to the gaming then they were worth - but that is exactly the kind of thing computers can do well behing the scenes... That would be a great feature to build in to a CRPG, in fact, I'm fairly sure I've seen it somewhere.
Ok why not suggest this topic to MythBusters. The force of a sling bullet... Or someone myth bust this themselves and post the video!
"...drafted for the war..." Hence, a soldier... Somewhere, I still have my selective service card. Balearic slingers were sheperds when they weren't fighting for (fill in the blank). Except for a few paid guards, there were no soldiers. The rest were militia. BTW, in "300", King Leonidas agrees with YOU. (Outstanding scene!) I think the former owners of the wolf skins on David's wall and back would agree with me: Goliath never had a chance.
For memory when Samuel comes to anoint the little shepherd boy, he mentions in passing that to protect the sheep he has killed lions with his bare hands (hence Michelagnolo's 'David' has him holding a lion skin over his shoulder if I am not mistaken). He also did mercenary work for the Philistines, but in what order that all occured I don't remember. I seem to remember it being common knowledge at our AD&D PnP parties that chainmail wouldn't stop damage from a bludgeoning weapon :shrug: Well they busted the old 'penny off the top of the Empire State' myth, based on it not having the (force? mass?) to penetrate the human skull.
Not sure about the validity of their methods. They did one about whether a bullet fired into the air would kill someone if it hit them when it came down. They decided not, but not by letting a bullet hit one of them. We had a kid killed locally that way a couple of years ago. I had to patch a hole in the steel roof of our Karate school 10 years ago from a .380 round. I believe the penny one though. The terminal velocity of a tumbling disc would not be very high. Plus, it is pretty much certain to land on a ledge. Let's try a sling bullet!
I took a look at wikipedia – there are three problems with my accuracy with the sling. 1. Construction - non-elastic material. Mine was too stretchy. 2. Ammunition- consistent size. I tried and practiced with many sizs. 3. Method- my method was underhand –according to wiki over hand is more accurate. So looks like I am incorrect in thinking slings are too accurate. About damage Where is the math and physics department when you need them… According to Slinging .org bullets travel at up to 250 miles per hour. Don’t trust my math but that is 366 feet per second. Don’t count on my physics but that is a 1lb bullet moving 366lbs (at rest in a vacuum, no friction ect ect) one foot in 1 second. Or 732lbs half a foot in a half second. That sounds like it would produce blunt force trauma to me. However, that is the top end of bullet weight 1-16 oz, the energy transfer would occur in less than one second and that is a critical hit – all of its potential- no deflection. So not 1d8, but 1d6 as a thrown club. It doesn’t have the weight of a club, but it is moving more than twice as fast. How about three types of bullet Stone -1 to hit 1d4+2 Small bullet 1d4+1 Large bullet 1d6 Staff sling 1d8
