That’s the problem

Hm, I know a little bit about governments that like to please foreign powers. We have some of that here. Only we know the reason why, our political parties in the govt are doing it because the foreign powers know all their dirty little secrets (our politicians have been "on the take" for every government contract since 1974, and they are afraid that if all their dirty work is revealed, they are going to have to leave the country in a hurry). So, as long as we are in "a state of emergency", arresting the corrupt politicians is "a luxury we cannot afford" as they themselves say.
Still, some advice (which you already know, I am sure) if you are going to be operating in warmer climates (as compared to Findland) make sure that your socks fit your feet well and that your nose is clear so you can breath from the nose and not htemouth before long marches, and be sure to wash the feet thorougly at the end of the day. You can also try using a pieace of cloth for the head to keep sweat from your eyes, and wearing the beret "loosely" on the head (if it is mandatory to wear it all thetime and they don't allow headpieces), so as not to accumulate heat. Also, remember to check boots and bedding for critters. They also like rucksacks.

@sirchet, an honourable thing to do. Respect to you.

@Sergio, please give Vlad my regards.

 

Re: Wish me luck

Please, everyone in Europe knows that all Greeks, including government, are lazy and corrupt to the bone. Greece was and is the source of our current financial crisis, they were never “officially” fit to join the Euro, but they joined nevertheless. A sore mistake, just like accepting the membership of Bulgaria and Romania. Before the latter we had no beggars on our streets, and now we can’t get rid of ‘em. Your current politicians are doing the only thing that keeps Greece from bankrupting, because we are sick and tired of spending our taxpayers euro’s to save your asses. We would be more than happy to kick Greece out from Euro and to join the rest of Balkan like Serbia, Croatia and the bloody Macedonia.

Thank you! No, I have not been given any training how to cope in hot environment, yet. So thank you very much. And no, we wear berets only in parades, other times we wear equipment that is required by the climate. If you wish, I can give you a handful of tips how to survive in cold and snow.

Dear Sergio, I really can’t figure you out: are you proud of your Russian and soviet history or are you ashamed of it? It is no secret that the Russian army was not in its peak when they kicked the hell out of gruusians. But the soviets were no more prepared when Adolph invaded and still you kicked some good Aryan ass. Give some credit when it is due. You are the only ones still flying to space and you have the largest and nastiest nuclear arsenal. Glory and respect where it is due. Btw. have you seen the great movie Мы из будущего? Or did I misspell it, don’t speak Russian that is.

 

Re: Wish me luck

First of all, there is only one Macedonia, and this is part of Greece. There is no separate nation "Macedonia". We are not interested in the name they (the people you refer to as "macedonians" and we refer to as skopjans) will choose for themselves, nor are we interested in incorporating part of their land. That name, however, cannot be "Macedonia" any more than it can be Attica (home of the Athenians) or Laconia (home of the Spartans).

All of us? Really? Sounds a bit racist, don't you think? Statistics, however disagree with you:

http://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DatasetCode=ANHRS

In that chart, you will find the average annual hours actually worked per worker. In 2011, this number was 2 032 hours for the average worker of my country. By means of comparison, the same number was 1 413 for the average German, and 1 476 for the average French.

I am not surprised to read such a statement, because it is just like governments and media to blame their own shortcomings on others. The fact of the matter is that Germany is actually proud of the deal they have in Greece.Please watch this short but informative piece from the first German channel (english subs):

[YOUTUBE]NLvkeqRbS34[/YOUTUBE]

I COMPLETELY AGREE!!!! Removing our national currency was the first step in making a colony out of Greece. In fact, the "evidence" that our government brought in order to get Greece to be accepted in the eurozone, was falsified by (including others) our current Minister of Finances, Ioannis Stournaras (who is a banker that no one voted for) and our previous Prime Minister Loukas Papadimos (again a banker, again he was not voted by anyone) who was appointed Prime Minister by three parties, the largest of which was PASOK (the "socialist"party (if they are socialists I am a viking)), the other two were Nea Dimokratia (the largest Right wing party) and LA.O.S (a "hardcore" right wing party, which broke off from Nea Dimokratia, and has currently been almost completely been removed from the political scene in favour of the Neonazi party Golden Dawn (yeah, we have our own 6.92% nazi party, courtesy of the treaty "Dublin 2", which our former prime Minister, George Papandreou, the man who brought the IMF to Greece, by falsifying evidence regarding the deficit signed when he was Minister of Foreign Affairs)). PASOK was the ruling party when we were admitted in the Eurozone, Papadimos was the president of the Bank of Greece.
But there is more.
SIEMENS HELLAS president, Mr. Christoforakos, was accused and about to stand trial for bribing Greek officials (this had been going on for decades, even with other SIEMENS HELLAS presidents), including ministers from PASOK and Nea Dimokratia. Many prominent current Greek politicians are said to feature in Christoforakos's lists. The only problem is that Christoforakos "somehow" managed to flee Greece and go to Germany, where he (and his information) are currently at the disposal of the German government. You understand that, if the current Greek government (currently consisting of Nea Dimokratia, PASOK (which has lost more than half of its political influence since 2009) and the Democratic Left
(a softcore, pro-EU "leftist" party) was to say no to Germany, Christoforakos would sing like a bird, and a very large number of Greek politicians of the avant-garde would go to jail.
So, you understand that they are not really doing their best to keep Greece from bankrupting, they are doing their best to save their own skins, by complying with what they are told to do.

Thank you for offering me the opportunity to speak about the current situation here, and I apologize for the long post.

No problem, anytime. About survival in snow-covered terrain, I've done some of that, too, of course I don't think it was anything like the temperatures up there, but thanks anyway.

 

Re: Wish me luck

I can not say that I am proud or ashamed of my country's history, because why should I be proud or ashamed of something I did not influence? I take pride and shame for my own deeds and their results.

But indeed, I try to maintain a noncotradictory and unbiased view of history, and to promote such a view. If some deed of historical subject was evil - why not to admit it, if it was for the good - why not to admit that?

I did not see the movie you mentioned, and you spelled it right.

 

Re: Wish me luck

Sergio said;

I can not say that I am proud or ashamed of my country's history, because why should I be proud or ashamed of something I did not influence? I take pride and shame for my own deeds and their results.

End quote.

Wow, you sir are a wise man with exceptional insight.

Btw, there are still space craft leaving Earth from America, they're just mostly done by private companies and for profit now.

 

Re: Wish me luck

Forgive me, the current namewars of the Balkan region are rather unknown to me. All I know that when I drove thru Balkan I drove thru Serbia and Macedonia before I entered Greece. The purpose of that trip was a pilgrimage to Ἁγία Σοφία in Κωνσταντινούπολις (as I do not recognize the current Turkish occupation). Nevertheless I honestly am not sure whether the current Greece municipality of Macedonia or the Formerly Yugoslavian Republic of Macedonia has anything to do with the historical Macedonia. Correct if I am wrong but weren’t Laconia and Attica Peloponnese states and as such Hellenic? And Ἀλέξανδρος ὁ Μέγας was born in Πέλλα? Was the latter a part of the area shared by Hellenes or was that time Macedonia a separate entity? I have been thought that Ἀλέξανδρος ὁ Μέγας was not a Hellenic ruler but a foreign conqueror that spread the Hellenic culture (with the help of his satrapies) after conquering the Hellenic world. In that sense he compares with Josif Stalin and Kublai Khan. With the exception that neither the Russians claim Gruusia nor the Chinese claim Mongolia to be a name that they exclusively own. Me no comprendo.

Something being “racist” requires something to be identified as a “race” and an assumption of said “race’s” quality to be known as an inherent quality to that race. I never said that the modern day Greeks are a race an sich nor that they are lazy tax avoiders because they are members of the said Greek race. Was I stereotyping and/or generalizing, yes I was. My mother’s sister was married with a Greek (from Ιωάννινα) for twenty three years. My three cousins are Greek nationals (dual citizenship with Sweden though) and I have spent summers in Greece since I was nine. Never did I see a house with a roof there, since one must not pay property taxes until the house is ready… Do not try to fool me, I have seen what it was in Greece in 1990 and what it still is in 2012. And those statistics you posted: yes they are from OECD, very respectable an sich, but did you read what was the OECD’s source? “National Accounts”. As we all know in EU, Greeks are especially well known from their “creative” representations of statics. My personal favorite is the case of the Greek island Ζάκυνθος which residents had more than nine times more blind people than the rest of the EU in average. Curiously a lot of those who collected the welfare checks as “visually impaired” were taxi drivers and professional hunters…
http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_articles_wsite1_1_17/09/2012_461697

Yes, and the average annual working hours per worker in Soviet Union must have been more than 3000 and in contemporary North Korea anything less than 5000 would be slacking. Try to find stats that are not based on governmental fabrication.

Aye. I should have read the whole post before opening my mouth, but then again that would have been too smart. Anyways, you’re right Greek government has zero credibility and that lack of trust is not going away.

Sorry to say but I got no English subtitles and my German is way too rudimentary to understand that. Another link perhaps?

Ah the smell of political corruption so closely bound to the stench of financial rotting corpse. I can’t make a half of sense what you just described, that alien it is to me. Dear lord.

A lot read and more to understand, always worth the effort. Thank you for updating me. But for a word of caution some of our MP (members of parliament) are already conversing on the social and financial benefits when Greece was under military dictatorship. Some of our MPs have already called tanks on the streets of Athens. And trust me, Finnish politicians lack all and any backbone unless they can trust support from the Reich. Just as a word of caution, EURO shall not be left to fall. I just hope that would not be the reason why I am re-enlisted.

There are just few thumb rules; drink a lot. Dry desert air dries you up just as frozen air. Only difference is that in the cold you will not notice the dehydration. So you rehydrate every chance you get. Pain is your friend, as long as it hurts you are ok, the moment something goes numb it is lost. Numbness comes when tissue is frozen deep enough to cause nerve damage. When that happens, amputation is the life giver. Moisture is your enemy, when in cold do not sweat, and if you do lose the wet clothes. Moisture conducts heat, to keep warm is to have dry clothes on. And as with the beret, your head loses the most heat, keep it warm alltimes. : D And never touch the snow unless it is frozen or you have clothes that won’t let the moisture thru.

Sergio, just watch the movie. It is worth seeing. And if it is not, you will promptly tell me. No?

 

Re: Wish me luck

" Romania. Before the latter we had no beggars on our streets, and now we can’t get rid of ‘em. "

Just stumbled across this post as not really into anything outside ToEE. First of all, Good luck Rocktoy.
I am romanian from generations and as, far as I know nobody in my family EVER begged. When I was young and unemployed I didn't even apply for the dole as I thought would not be fair. The HUGE mistake 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999% of westerners, unfortunatelly make is to exchange romanians (descendants of the Dacians,more than valiant warriors-part of keltoi family!!!!!) for the rromani-gypsies (scientifically proven to be an ethnic group provenient from more or less a territory between nowaday India and Pakistan...)
I don't want to start any polemics here, I am just growing so tired of this misconception. Being Romanian means being proud of a Cioran, a Brancusi, a Mircea Helliade and why not of Nadia Comaneci and Ilie Nastase......

 

Re: Wish me luck

We do not claim the name of Macedonia, the name is Greek, exclusively. Alexander, Philip and all the names of the Macedonians were Greek (they have meaning in Greek) whereas the have no meaning in other languages, particularly no meaning in Bulgarian, which is the language of the ones you refer to as Macedonians.
Regarding separate state entities, there was no single Greek state at that time. It was the era of city-states. Very often Greek cities were at war with each other, and very often they would form some, usually short-lived alliances. The Macedonians were Dorian Greek, they were part of the Amfictionic Convention with Philip the second, father of Alexander the Great (which made them OFFICIALLY Greek).
The ancient Macedonia covered the area of the Greek Macedonia and the area of Skopje as well as a small part of Bulgaria. Those you refer to as "Macedonians" (the Skopjans) are in fact of bulgarian and slavic ancestry, and are not related to the ancient Macedonians at all.

Let's leave it at that, then.

We have about 20 different property taxes here. Is it "immoral" to wish to pay the (excessive) amount of tax for something from the moment you have it as a functional item at your disposal?
I don't understand how you think I am trying to "fool you".

Interesting point. Because the Greek government faslified statistics, we can draw the conclusion that ALL statistics coming from Greece are falsified. Well, if you don't believe me, you could come and work in Greece. It's a win-win situation. If these statistics are falsified, you will be able to have free holidays here in Greece, since you will have so much free time. If they are real, you may appreciate what the Greek working person has to go through for his/her salary.

I don't know what happened in the Soviet Union, and I certainly don't know what is taking place in North Korea, but do you have proof that the SPECIFIC stats I presented were fabricated?

Here:

Actually, could you please show me WHERE I said that? I dont' recall having said such a thing, and I went through my posts in this thread. I understand that there can sometimes be a mixup with quotes.

This is not "creative" representation of statistics, this is downright fraud. However, I have some questions:
1. What percentage of the total number of Greek working people and actual disabled people does this stand for? Is that enough to condemn a whole nation?

2. Do you think that if one searches closely some such cases will not be found in other countries, even countries of the north? Do you think that, if the system of these countries had "gaps" such cases would not multiply?

Your captions option is probably off by default. You could press the "captions" tab, and choose "English". (bottom right corner, it's the first tab, after that you have the 'change quality", "watch later", and "small player" "large player" 'full screen" options.

I believe you, however, if by saying "The Reich" you mean Germany, I must caution you that, if the Greek politicians were the ones being bribed, the German SIEMENS, were the ones bribING. Now, as far as I know, it's not just the person taking bribery who is corrupt and punishable by law, but also the one who is bribing. And SIEMENS was conducting dirty business not only in Greece, but in other countries, even including the USA. Did the German authorities fail to notice SIEMENS's dirty businesses abroad despite its immense magnitude? Were they unconcerned because it benefited Germany, or did the actually USE that information in order to hold some governments or individual politicians as puppets (as is the case of Greece)?

Thank you for this information.

 

Re: Wish me luck

There was some mention of work hours per year in Soviet Union, I can enlighten you. In later years Soviet citizens had 40 hour work week, which nets
(365 days per year / 7 days per week) * 40 work hours per week = 2086 work hours per year

Now to exclude state holidays: 1 January, 7 January, 8 March, 1,2 May, 9 May, 7 October, 7,8 November, which gives more than 40 but less than 80 work hours.

So, in later Soviet Union there were slightly more than 2000 work hours per year.

 

Re: Wish me luck

From what I can understand, Rocktoy seems to consider working hours as directly and solely related to quantity and quality of production, and therefore reaches the conclusion that, since for example food production in North Korea is lacking, therefore this must be due to the fact that North Korean farmers and food-production related professionals don't work. he does not seem to take into account available means of production, though. A farmer may try to plough a field with a shovel (or similar low tech tool) for 12 hours, and achieve the same result as the result he could obtain with a modern tractor, in just one hour. At least this is my understanding, I don't know if this is what he meant.

 

Re: Wish me luck

Usually when I figure a salary I think of a 40 hour work week for 52 weeks, for any good employer will pay for most holidays and sick days.

I figure to pay for 2080 hours and receive right around 2000 hours of productive work.

Of course, that's from a good employee or a "Keeper" as I often refer to them as.

 

Re: Wish me luck

Excellent point. Indeed, they say, a primitive farmer could only produce food for himself and possibly one more human, while working ultra-hard, yet effective contemporary agriculture-related worker provides for 50 and more, while working 2080 hours per year. I think I already posted this somewhere here... hmm... I am getting old and repetitive then.

 

Re: Wish me luck

I never meant to soil the good name of the proud families from Magyar, Dacia, Bulgarie, nor Illyria. Nor did I seek to dishonor the noblesse of those regions. I am painfully aware that that the grand majority, if not the entirety, of beggars we see on our streets are gypsies. Members of organized crime, and as such are required to pay tribute, to their domestic crime lords. But saying so out loud, even as it is true, would be seen as racist and I would have been yet again in fractioned by Gear or his equivalents. Freedom of speech is respected only as long as it supports the world view of its supporters. My honest apologies to you and the proud Dacians!

Oh no. You cannot do that: first open a topic for discussion and then say it is off limits. Just remember: I am not to judge nor slander, I am to learn. The durians were the first? What about the Jonias and the Helens? History of the ancient is not known to me, but I am always ready to know more.

How many of those taxes presented on paper you actually pay? But yes, tax evasion is and will be the only response for all those who can do it. I am from an old and respectable Gentry house, it has been a centuries honored tradition to evade taxes. Is that right? No. Those who can pay the taxes should do so, and not those who can barely support themselves.

Since the Greek government falsifies SOME documents their reputation is forever lost, at least here in the north. Corruption and decadent is the very thing that separates us, the puritan protestants, from the corrupt Catholics. Greek or Roman. And no there are no open jobs for ρωμαϊκός in Greece, hell there are no jobs for anyone,

No. But have no proof that they weren’t. And as such the Greek government has no reliability. Which is not of my doing.

You said what and for what I failed to respond?

I do not care nore should I. A corrupt nations is a corrupt nations.

2. Do you think that if one searches closely some such cases will not be found in other countries, even countries of the north? Do you think that, if the system of these countries had "gaps" such cases would not multiply?
Yes. We do have our own structural corruption, even if we got the prize of being the worlds most least corrupt country. Corruptions is ever present.



Your captions option is probably off by default. You could press the "captions" tab, and choose "English". (bottom right corner, it's the first tab, after that you have the 'change quality", "watch later", and "small player" "large player" 'full screen" options.



I believe you, however, if by saying "The Reich" you mean Germany, I must caution you that, if the Greek politicians were the ones being bribed, the German SIEMENS, were the ones bribING. Now, as far as I know, it's not just the person taking bribery who is corrupt and punishable by law, but also the one who is bribing. And SIEMENS was conducting dirty business not only in Greece, but in other countries, even including the USA. Did the German authorities fail to notice SIEMENS's dirty businesses abroad despite its immense magnitude? Were they unconcerned because it benefited Germany, or did the actually USE that information in order to hold some governments or individual politicians as puppets (as is the case of Greece)?

Lost you there. No fucking idea what you were talking about. Care to clarify? Nevertheles: Καλά Χριστούγεννα

 

Re: Wish me luck

It's not off limits. The Dorian Greeks were not actually the first, it was the Ionians the Aeolians and the most ancient, the Achaeans (the ones who were involved in the Trojan war). The Ionians and the Dorians were the two most powerful in the classical era. The Dorians were the last of the Greek tribes to appear. Their patriarch was Dorus, although if I recall correctly, Dorian nobility claimed ancestry from Hercules himself. The founding patriarch of the Ionians was said by legend to be Ion.
If you look carefully, at some ancient sculptures, coins, etc, you will see that Alexander is wearing a lionskin as helmet. This was to symbolise that he descends from Hercules, as the rest of Dorian Greek nobility.

The two tribes had completely different mentality. The Dorian Greeks were a far more "conservative" and militaristic society (they were oligarchic and not democratic), whereas the Ionians, (particularly Athenians) were much more "open" and they were democratic.
The Dorian Greeks were powerful in land battles, but the Ionian Greeks were powerful in the sea.
The difference in mentality and world view was bound to cause a clash between the big boys of the fifth century, Athens and Sparta. However, when the Persians came, they decided to set aside their differences and unite as Hellenes.
When they defeated the Persians, the Hellenes (Dorians and Ionians) resumed their infighting for domination over Hellas.
You can find more here, because I might not remember everything right:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorians

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ionians

Finally, the Spartans defeated the Athenians (they were supported by means of gold in their war effort by Persia). However, the Spartans were defeated by the Thebans (whom nobody liked because during the Persian wars they had taken the side of the Persians).
The Thebans were in turn defeated by the Macedonians, once in the battle of Chaeronia, by Philip, a few years later, after the death of Philip (the Greek cities under Alexander did that) and a third time, when Thebes persuaded Athens to revolt against Alexander, at which time Alexander burned Thebes to the ground.

And we come to modern Greece:

All of them. Since you ask, my family and I pay ALL of them. Also, the people I know do the same thing. The majority of the Greek middle class and lower class does that. In fact, the majority of the middle and lower class, takes the "weight" of most of the taxes. There fore, this statement:

is invalid, regardless of what you believe. Of course, you may believe what you like, facts, however do not change from that.

I completely agree. 100%. However, those who can avoid taxes usually do so everywhere, because those who have the (financial) power can control the way laws are made, because they control those who make the laws (politicians).

I cannot understand what you say here, but we Greeks are NOT Catholic we are Orthodox. And to say that "we, the Protestants are good and not corrupt but the Catholics and the Orthodox are corrupt" (if this is what you are saying) is a huge pile of bulls*** pardon my French. You cannot separate people like that. People are people, there are good people and bad people everywhere, regardless of color, religion, or nationality. To say that "this nation or that nation is corrupt" is insulting.

Nor is it of my doing. I agree that the Greek government(s) is/are corrupt, that's what I've been saying as well.


I showed you examples of German corruption. Perhaps you did not see them.
Here is a link if you are interested:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/14/b...ens-executives-charged-with-bribery.html?_r=0

So, as you see the Germans can also be corrupt. And SIEMENS was not just bribing people in Greece, where "everyone is corrupt", they were bribing in other countries as well. How can this be? If the German Government and Mass Media tell you that the Greeks are corrupt, should you believe them?

That was instructions on how to see the video on how Germany makes a lot of money off Greece. Now, I could say that you are trying to avoid watching this video, making various excuses such as "I can't see the English subs" (even though the subs are there for everyone to see) and say that you do this because you generally "close your eyes" when you face arguments that don't suit you, but I am going to be a good guy, and, in the spirit of Christmas am not going to say such a thing.

Thank you. Καλά Χριστούγεννα, κι ευτυχισμένος ο καινούργιος χρόνος!!! Hyvää joulua ja onnellista uutta vuotta!!!

 

Re: Wish me luck

As I said, the antiquity is rather unknown to me. I was under the impression that the Minoans from the isle of Crete were the oldest? And wasn’t Troy an Ionian city which was besieged by both Athens and Spartans? Centuries before Alexander?

I’ve been told that the Spartans were an geriatrocy, lead by a council of old men. As the Athens were an aristocracy led by a council of free men. Neither had anything to do with democracy, as it is comprehended in this day.

Of that I have no knowledge.

You must be speaking about the 5th century before Christ, 5th century was the end of Roman empire, the Persians as the Spartans were nothing but ghosts at that time.

Thank you for the effort, but wikipedia is not a reliable source of information. ISBN?

Was that a short representation of the Peloponnesian wars? Which took place way after the Persian wars, led by the one Alexander?

No we do not. What you described, was ancient history. You forgot the legacy of Byzantine. The fifteen hundred years of Κωνσταντινούπολη.

It seems that I stand corrected.



I completely agree. 100%. However, those who can avoid taxes usually do so everywhere, because those who have the (financial) power can control the way laws are made, because they control those who make the laws (politicians).

That is how we here in the North are told. As Protestants we are thought to see BOTH southern churches as corrupt and decadent. Both of those “decadent” churches are called catholic (the Roman Catholic and the Greek Catholic). Personally, I have abandoned the protestant (heretic) church and chosen to seek membership of the one true church under the patriarchy of Κωνσταντινούπολη. But that is my choice, the grand majority of my countrymen will still see the south as heretic and corrupt.

Never meant say nor imply otherwise.