Rouge builds

I had been having a lot of trouble with dead rouges. Not enough hit points, not enough armour. Too much hack and slain.

Then I tried a fighter rouge dwarf with maxed out constitution. First level fighter, the rest rouge.

Full plate enchanted to plus three with a tower shield enchanted to plus three.

Amulet of constitution to bring the Hp up even further. Avaraged 10 HP per level.

Improved feint and lots of points in bluff lets me sneak attack in plain melee.

Put togehter it all makes for an awesomely effectivtive front line tank.

But I have some questions about how to carry on with the build.

Would improved trip also allow sneak attacks on a successful trip? If so what weapons can I use to trip with?

Does Use magic skill allow a rouge to cast spells from scrolls or to use wands / starves? If so how many points do I need to allocate to do this?

How do you work your rougues?

 

Re: Rogue builds

A rogue can only sneak attack:

1. living creatures with discernible anatomies - undead, constructs, oozes, plants and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks.

2. a target that would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether or not the target actually has a Dexterity bonus) or when the rogue flanks the target. Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet.

3. barbarians (that have Improved Uncanny Dodge (i.e. that have 5 or more barbarian levels)) by flanking them only if the attacker has at least 4 more rogue levels than the target has barbarian levels.

4. rogues (that have Improved Uncanny Dodge (i.e. that have 8 or more rogue levels)) by flanking them only if the attacker has at least 4 more rogue levels than the target does.

In this computer game, you can trip a target by making an unarmed attack or using ANY melee weapon. This is completely different to the D&D 3.5 role-playing game, where only a select few melee weapons (such as the spiked chain) are able to trip a target.

Personally, I would only attempt to trip a target if:

1. the tripper has the Improved Trip feat (+4 bonus to trip check)

2. the tripper has a higher Strength modifier than the target (strength bonus to trip check)

3. the tripper is not a smaller size category than the target (otherwise the larger target has a size bonus to its trip check).

4. the target is not stable (the Behemoth Kingfrog is stable) (otherwise the target has a +4 stability bonus to its trip check).

5. the target is not immune to tripping (Noble Salamanders, Iuz, and St. Cuthbert are all immune to tripping).

Originally posted by EvilCatEars:

Personally, I ALWAYS have an elven rogue who never multiclasses and who always takes the Two-Weapon Fighting feat at level 1 and who wields 2 melee weaons (his off-hand weapon is always a light weapon so that he receives a +2 bonus to hit with both of his weapons).
My rogue always has an 18 Strength (I always increase his Strength ability when levelling up), an 18 Dexterity (so that my rogue can get the maximum Dexterity bonus to AC while wearing Blue Elven Chain armour), as good a Constitution that I can roll, and as good an Intelligence that I can roll (so that he can get as many skill points as possible).
My rogue always selects from the following feats: Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Weapon Focus, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Defense, Improved Critical.
My rogue always takes the Crippling Strike special rogue feat when he reaches level 10, then he takes Improved Evasion later on.
My rogue always has maximum ranks in the following skills: Tumble (so that he can move around the battlefield at will), Spot & Listen (so that my party can avoid unwanted random encounters), Open Lock (so that he can unlock Brother Smyth's chest - once he has done this, he doesn't need to put any more skill ranks in Open Lock skill because the spell Knock can be used for the rest of the game instead), Appraise (so that my party gets the best prices when buying and selling items), Bluff & Diplomacy & Gather Information & Intimidate & Sense Motive (so that my rogue has the maximum possible choices when conversing with NPCs - I always use my rogue as the spokesperson for my party, so my rogue is always out in front of my party so that NPCs always choose to talk to him).
During the first round of combat, if my rogue is within range of a target that is flatfooted, then he always attacks a flatfooted target (so that he can sneak attack the target).
During combat, if my rogue is not within range of any flatfooted targets, then he always delays his action until another character has moved into melee range of a target and then my rogue flanks the target so that my rogue can sneak attack the target.
I have found that my two melee weapon-wielding single-class rogues do more damage than my fighters, but my rogues are almost useless against targets that are immune to sneak attacks (such as Zuggtmoy), so fighters are much more useful against such opponents.
Some other forum members (such as Necroticpus) claim (probably correctly) that a single-class rogue that uses a Strength 18 composite longbow that has been crafted to +3 enhancement with Flaming Burst, Icy Burst, and Shocking Burst enchantments is the deadliest and most damaging character in the game. I personally don't do any item crafting (because I already find the game too easy and it's just the way that I prefer to play the game - it makes the magical items that you find in the game so much more precious!) and I prefer to concentrate on melee fighting (I don't like spellcasting or using ranged weapons - that's just the way that I prefer to play D&D - it's just personal preference).

 

If a target is tripped are they denied a dexterity bonus?

When i equip my rouge with a scroll the scroll does not come up on action wheel. but decipher script does - however this only allows me to identify the scroll not to use it.

In terms of the came interface how do i use a scroll, wand or staff?

 

The problem with Rouges is that they're overpowdered. heh.

 

Rogues benefit massively from multiple attacks when sneak attacking.
Combining a sneak-attacking duel wield with a monk's flurry of blows, you're doing a gigantic amount of damage.
Studded leather armor (I think that's the one) with 20 dex gives an AC of 19, which is actually superior to the fighters, generally.
Combine that dexterity with weapon finesse, and their hit rolls will be incredible at low levels.
A hasted, rapid-shot rogue shooting at (glitterdust) blinded enemies, and you've got a lot of dead enemies, very, very quickly. The damage that piles up is just scary once the sneak attack damage gets high enough.

 

are blinded opponants denied a dexterity bonus?


Also using a druid to summon up a flanking monster also adds to the carnage :joy:

 

All I know is that sneak attack works on blinded targets, even with missile weapons.

 

My rogues...

Generally take double short swords or daggers with Weapon Finesse. This cuts down on the need for high strength and their sneak attacks still add up to huge damage. Also makes it easier to focus that single weapon. Using a Rogue / Cleric that dual wields light maces, right now. The fact that Calmert sells silver ones with a +1 hit bonus right from teh start makes things much nicer.

You just have to be aware of their placement in battle. Personally, I like exploring the dungeon with a sneaking Rogue, killing sentries solo while the rest of the party kicks it up the hall until she finds a nice big group. Have her stay on the side until everyone else gets into position, then sneak attack away.

Must say, I do like the idea of summoning monsters to aid in a flank. Gonna have to try that next time...

 

The rogue may be the first one to act at the start of a combat due to their often high dexterity, but it doesn't mean that they need to actually be the first to charge the enemy. It's often best to wait until the fighter-types have engaged, and only then send the rogue in to flank. If they go in first, alone, before the fighters have had a chance to act, then yeah, they're going to get pounded.

 

So far, I've stuck to multi-class elven Fighter/Rogues with bows and normally use them to initiate combat with the Rapid Shot/Sneak Attack combination on the most dangerous target(s). Invisibility items make it much easier, but sneaking suffices until you can get one.

 

True starting as a thief gives more skill points but starting as a fighter gives more hit points.

I go “o natuel” when removing traps or opening locks but put my amour back on for general party business.

 

Its amazing how liberating an amour class of 33 can be when it comes to wading into the fray!

 

A rogue 1/ fighter 1 has exactly the same hit points as a fighter 1/ rogue 1. You don't even need to leave town to get to level 2.

 

Really? I didnt know - i thought it was max hit points on the first level only, not on the first level of each class.