Circle of Eight Modpack v7 / v7 NC General Commentary & Discussion Thread

Hi as this is my first post I would like to thank Gaer and the team for producing such amazing content and for equally important bugfixing, which has made the world of Greyhawk real again for me, in a way the original TOEE PC game never did due to its many bugs.

I hope the following doesn't contain any spoilers for anybody. I'm not sure how to make my comments hidden to those who might not want to read certain things, so I have tried to be as vague as possible. Please let me know if anyone thinks otherwise, or better yet some advice on how to write with "invisible" letters would be ace!

I have had a great time blitzing through the 7.0 game the past two weeks, but have reached an impasse post-Slavers. I wonder if anyone else has encountered the 6-7 Gremlichs bug???!!! At least I hope it's a bug. After a long and apparently futile battle against just one I was able to escape by means of a Teleport scroll. Returning to the scene resumed the encounter, with a similar outcome - clearly I was outmatched or had missed a clue as to how to defeat the thing. After doing a little homework I returned to the save pre-scroll spell and thought I used the right strategy, though when I thought battle should have ended, the monster came back as so many times before yet just stood out of combat. I returned to Nulb (I was on the outskirts of the village) to recuperate, and prepare to do it yet again. On returning across the bridge from Nulb, I was greeted by 7 Gremlichs. Needless to say they made poisoned mincemeat out of my party fairly quickly. From the earlier savepoint in battle, Teleporting away now causes the enemy to multiply in my absence as well.

For the record this quest did not begin for me either until I used the console, as Gaer advised Chano in another thread. And I was having the same aggressive old man problem as zebrainz and chano, so I'm going to go back to an earlier save having dl'ed the bugfix (thanks!) I'll see if I can beat the slavers again in legendary fashion, at least they die!

 

Yea I am sure we did not hit him. I had went to an earlier savegame and was able to add him and let him die without getting butcher.

When you add him you have a choice of drunk or not drunk etc. I think that there are different instances of him/versions however you want to phrase it. Some bug some don't.
Well I think the rule of thumb, for now, should be to keep saves before adding NPCs. From what I learned in my saves, any save after adding him, his death, anywhere, any kind of combat would trigger butcher- no matter what. If however i went to before I added him to my party, and added him. No problems.

 

OH I just had a quick thought...
Maybe its not him dying as a party NPC that is triggering it. If you killed him, or he died OUTSIDE of your party, woudln't that trigger butcher?
maybe, somehow, upon adding him it was still considering him, for the purpose of death, a non-party member.
Obviously I have no idea how the game code works, but it was just a thought of trying ti figure out how or what i might have done in the instances I added him that were ok, and the instances I added him adn it gave me butcher every time he died.

Also there may be some way in teh dialogues that you alter his attitude towards you, and if he aggroes on you, maybe that triggers butcher at death.

 

A lengthy update for you Gaear:

I defeated the Gremlich although I couldn't complete the quest. My PCs did not gain XP from the battle, following which Mona was not to be found. Serena could not comment on her whereabouts.

Having applied the patch here http://www.co8.org/forum/showpost.php?p=111285&postcount=14, the old man still attacked. I tried a number of methods for applying the patch files, and I'm pretty sure they have replaced the old files in my directory (the patch files seem to be dated 1/2/2012 - thanks for getting "back to work" so soon following the holidays!). So perhaps the bug has different origins in my game?

In any case, I tried several times and he always attacked on sight. I was able to progress to the WOTGS by first casting Dominate Person on the old man, then casting Charm Person on Kentor Nevis and Charm Monster on Ariakas (who became unfriendly after the old man joined my party as per the spell). Originally I tried Dominate Monster on Ariakas, though he would eventually save against the spell and I would need to use my wand on him again - Charm Person worked for the duration of the quest, and after he joined my party there was no Charm Person marker under his pic, so I assumed there would be no repercussions and that he was behaving as normal (the Dominate Person marker remained present beneath the old man's pic for the entire quest, and Dominate Monster had a similar result on Ariakas). It was amusing to have him go from attacking me to saying "I'm glad to see you Caradoc" or whatever he says in the dialogue. Following the dialogue the dominated old man remained in my party "in spirit" - the Dominate Monster graphic of blue lights hovered around my party, and he was present in my formation, took a party slot, and there was an open circle for him each time the entire party moved. I even had the chance to level him up. Kentor was also "in my formation" for the WOTGS though he did not appear outside his building.

In spite of the awkward beginning, I found tearing up the Hextorites to be very entertaining. I believe the quest may be rather easy going for high level parties, as you are probably well aware. My party of 5 PCs of levels 13-18, and Ariakas, suffered no damage in the first skirmish. I did have three deaths in the second, however after levelup the battles became elementary, though still fun. And no I didn't bother with my Dominate Monster wand or certain spells which just didn't seem fair in the circumstances. Yes I took pity on the Hextorites lol.

Prior to the last two skirmishes (S & SW) my game caught another bug. My party would not move together as I advanced on the enemy, and only moved sporadically individually. The enemy did not activate - i.e. the characters remained in their frozen "ready" positions. I was able to initiate combat, and my characters moved fine during this, though ranged attacks and spells didn't happen - no arrows flew, no spell graphics or effects following an initial successful Stinking Cloud. Following range attack attempts the character's turn would not end unless I attempted to use an inventory item. I marched right through the enemy slaughtering them with Scather and assorted swords, and hardly anyone fought back. Following death all enemies remained standing, though dead. It wasn't much fun doing this, or hobbling around between battles, but I was so close I just decided to see it to the end. Following the final battle I went immediately to Verbobonc, where my party moved fine. I brought Ariakas back to the CoL to recover (and feast I presume!) After resting 3 days in the castle, I started the dialogue with Ariakas which went fine, quest completed. Then he made ready to leave and apparently recalled an earlier grudge, and attacked me. What a guy, in my own castle! Charming him now works only as long as the spell lasts, after which he wants to kill me. Was it something I did?

Oh and the old man's pic is still in my party (perhaps the spell is still working - don't know if it will just disappear altogether after the spell duration, Dominate Person lasts a pretty long time I guess). And returning to Hommlett my party freezes now. No movement possible on the map (at least at S end, it occurs to me I haven't tried entering from N or E but I don't see how that would be any different). Now that that's all out I think I might take a break from TOEE! Though I'm looking forward to the prospects of a rendesvous with Lady Asheroth And it would be nice if the Hommlett map weren't frozen forever, I have an extraplanar chest I left back there...

I hope this is an appropriate place to post this info - it's a bit off-topic from the original post. I am happy to start another thread if that's recommended. Cheers

 

I have been playing the 7.0 NC mod and am looking forward to the new content. Along the way, I have noticed a few things that I thought I would report on.

1) I gained the reputation of 'Butcher of Hommlet' when Fruella died in combat as a member of my party. I made sure this was repeatable. Up to this point, the only people in Hommlet who had died were Furnok and Spugnoir. This only started with version 7.0. I saw in other posts that people were having this issue with Elmo so I have to believe this is being caused by the same issue. I am also certain that I never hit her.

2)

I encountered this as well but I didn't realize what the source was. It's not a big deal but it does happen. The same is true when I go to the bizaar of the bizarre after having killed Senshock - there is a spell that gets cast every time I enter in the location where he would be standing if he had lived and fled.

3) I tend to play a NG party so I don't like to join any of the temple factions. However I do like to learn about the ogre cave so I can clean it out as well. So I talk to Alrrem. I get his first quest but I kill the troll king instead so I can botch the quest and not become a member of the fire temple. After doing this, in past versions, I could go back and talk to Alrrem and he would complain, the first quest would be botched, but then he would go ahead and give me the second quest. This stopped happening in version 6.0 or 6.1. It is still happening with 7.0 so I opened up Alrrem's dialogue file. I found that if I do nothing more than move line 301 down 2 lines, relabel 302 to 301, 303 to 302, and 301 to 303, I could suddenly complete the dialogue like I had in the past. I realize that this probably means that there is a problem in dialogue file but I couldn't spot it. I did notice that the line in question - the one originally numbered 301, has a 1 where there is normally an 8 (see below) but changing it to an 8 did not make a difference. Reshuffling the order did. It might be fair to assume that the new line 301 now does not fire properly but I don't have the right conditions to test that.

Originally: {303}{Oohlgrist is dead!}{}{1}
Should be?: {303}{Oohlgrist is dead!}{}{8}

I also noticed that there is not a line {-7} to go with the line that is the {1}. Normally each player choice has 2 lines, one for 8 and the other for -7. I tried copying the original line 301 and making the copy 302 with -7 and then incrementing the lines afterwards up by 1 but it still didn't fire off. Only the shuffling did it.

4) When I returned to Alrrem after having killed all of the ogres in the ogre cave, I couldn't get the dialogue to report that I had killed them. So I opened up the file again and simply removed the criteria needed for this dialogue to kick off and saved. Sorry but I'm a bit eager to see the new stuff. When I get through my initial run, I'll try to devote some time to going through this file and seeing if I can spot what is going on (unless someone else can do it before then). There is clearly some issue(s) in Alrrem's dialogue file though.

5) I did not encounter the 2 crystal oozes during my second visit to the moathouse. They used to appear where the ogre in the basement is. Everything else was there, just not the oozes. Were they removed? (Maybe even in a prior version)?

6) As I left the moathouse after my second visit, there was a body for one of the brigand archers still outside the moathouse cave where the ambush took place. All the other bodies were gone but not this one. I had not been there for many days (probably 2 weeks game time) since the ambush so it just seemed a little odd.

7) I returned to Hickory Branch after having cleaned it out. In the cave where Lord Humungous is found, one orc soldier's body was still laying there. (just like the body in #6). They simply never go away.

8) Small typo: The old gnome at the bottom of the narrow shaft says: "Use gnomes, we always know." 'Use' should be 'Us'.

9) I did something I do not normally do and killed Rannos Davl when I confronted the traders about the assassin. Gremag got away and I eventually battled Gremag and his buddies in Nulb. Since then, I did a lot of other things so it has been a while in game time. I thought I would visit the traders establishment again just to see if some Hextorites were hiding out there. They were not but Rannos was alive again but badly hurt - I could see his damage by hovering my mouse above his picture along the top. He was invisible too and attacked my party as soon as they entered. I have tried using See Invisible, Dispel Magic, Fireball, Cone of Cold, and Greater Dispel Magic all in an attempt to engage or reveal him. However nothing works. He just attacks my party every round and I seem to have no way to strike back. I think I might have killed him when I had a few members of my party get an opportunity to attack when he went invisible in order to escape. If I reload and enter again, I find that it is repeatable. It would be funny if I could hit him again. As it is, I just reloaded and am avoiding the place.

10) I talked to Brother Smith and he told me about the Hextorites and to talk to the adventurer in Nevits house. I did and got the WotGS quest. He told me to check back in every couple of days and I have done so. For the first 2 or 3 days, he told me that there was nothing to report. However, after those first few days, the adventurer will not respond to any attempt I make at conversation. I have tried exiting and re-entering. Leaving, spending days at the Inn, and returning has not helped as well. The Hextorites have not shown up either. Since the adventurer is not repsonding to my attempts to talk to him, I'm worried that I will not be able to do the quest. Is there anything that I can check to see what might be the problem? I will mention that I hadn't picked up the golden skull yet at this point - it was still in the chest back at the temple. I have since gone there and picked it up but I still get no response from the adventurer. Again please let me know what I can do to fix this.

I would also like to report that I have only had one CTD. However, I have had 4 instances where I left the Inn of the Welcome Wench and my party was stuck in their poses like when the game first comes up. The other villagers were the same way. I could go to the world map and select other locations. If I stayed in Hommlet, my party would remain stuck (and unable to move). If I selected a place that had me leave town, the issue would clear. There were a few common traits with these 4 freeze instances - it was always at night and it only happened when I left the Welcome Wench. I can live with this but I thought I should mention it in case someone else comes along and says that they had this experience (they're not crazy).

 

@mmoneagle

I had this as well in my many attempts to activate WotGS without the old man being hostile (before and after downloading the fix). After 2 days had passed, the Traveler went silent and unresponsive. You could almost set your watch by it. I did have success getting the old man/WotGS activation dialog if I let 2 full days pass and then make sure I entered at night. Seemed to help get the old man to show up. Traveler auto dialog is delayed 2-4 seconds real time after entering Nevit's house when the old man is there for me. The silence of the Traveler didn't seem to affect the quest activation one way or another in my game. I had no trouble activating the quest after he had gone silent and unresponsive.

Jerk stop report, I think. In the middle of WotGS, I put my entire party in sneak mode to get the jump on the Hextorite miscreants on the west road, the party was located behind the Militia Captain's house. Individually, or as a party, the blue highlights for location of directed PC movement would light up normally, but the party would only move about 1/4 inch in the direction of the blue highlights before stopping. Took them all out of sneak mode, the problem stopped. Traveler was slaved to party leader's sneak mode during this process. My one and only encounter with 'jerk stop' ever. Didn't even think it worth mentioning until the two previous posts. Not really a big deal.

 

Jerkstop is acting normally in my 7.0 install: showing up around level four.

 

Do I have to speak with Mona to continue the Gremlich quest? Since I bought Serena, Mona is no longer to be found. Also without consoling, I couldn't get the entire quest.

btw. The old overgrown gekkos were far better looking than these new overgrown winged apes... oke:

 

2nd playthrough, LE party. Since there are some folks trying to read this thread without spoilage, I'll do it like this.









Text with spoilers starts below:

Spoiler

1. Could not activate WotGS: Attacker without a Hextor follower in the [0] party leader position. Had a cleric and monk Hextorite with the face skillset in the party. If one of them was not in the party leader position, no extra dialog to activate. Didn't matter if I singled them out and used them to 'talk' to Traveler. Wakefield goes straight to party leader for convo. My normal party leader was a (non-Hextor) Rogue. WAI?

2. WotGS: Attacker completed, Smythe gone, no way to end game, no Quarry, no end-boss-fight-party-getting-their-butts-whupped thingy. Maybe 120 Cuthberts scattered in small tribes (<-David Bowie plagarism) around Hommett could complete this thing. Almost an apt ending to that scenario. No one and I mean no one left in Hommett. Ha! Ha! says the smelly dog fighting man with Hextor's underwear on his head.

3. WotGS: Defender, Elementalist's gear is not cursed to disappear (Cloak of Midnight or some such), possible related problems?:
- Wind wall spell permanancy. It cleared later when entering Jaroo's on internal Hommett map change during WotGS. Good thing too, Jaroo's dialog was not available to help, understandable in this case, just sayin'. He would heal, that's it. Also, invisibility sphere remained in place in the area for standard duration of the spell after the Elementalist was dead. It behaved as if it were a Greater Spere of Invisibility if there is such a thing. Invisibility of affected creatures was unaffected by attacks or attacking when in area. Wind graphics expired with spell. Might have started when I cast Dominate Person on him. He never acted like he was charmed, although it said so when I hovered over his status. Meh, maybe he just kept rolling 20s to save.
- Choke point in Nevet's front yard right where Elementalist appears. Long travel on the road toward the Guard Tower from say Smythe's house to the corner of Nevet's wall straight along the road detours through that Elementalist's spot, long after battle is complete. Entire party does it.
- Endless AoO's from Glaive bearing creatures in (near) same spot. Wizard stepped up to the edge of Nevet's porch and tried to cast a spell. AoO's were expected. They continued until she died (at least 50+, maybe more, I took a bathroom break after that, when I came back she was dead). Her AC was high enough that they only hit on crits or failed crits so it took awhile. She was within range of about three hostiles when this occured. She had every crafted AC item + the best AC treasure I could lay my hands on.

To be clear, I'm talking about the area underneath the tree(s) directly in front of the Town Elder's house. Tight area to begin with.

4. 2nd playthrough for me. 1st was NG with old man aggro problems (fixed). On this playthrough as NE, no RE for the merry men all the way up to the end boss fight. Did a significant amount of travel and lolligaging. Got 12 trolls, 13 ettins, bunch of hill giants. No Robin. I seem to keep getting Ikian and crew (one occurance per different story arc save) in the vicinity of the WotGS time frame though. General vicinity of day 45 to day 50.

5. The St. Cuthberts boss fight is beyond me. Way beyond. So far. Still trying though.

6. Hommett flame strike graphics, shaking, etc. still in effect long after WotGS is completed. Both LG and NE playthroughs.

Pretty sure I still have some misconceptions (as usual for me) about what is supposed to be happening in game, info above provided as input, not complaint. WotGS Defender is an awesome mod. Great work and remains true to the original mod's concept. Thanks to all you modders who put this thing together. Never thought I'd be able to play something this close to the orignal D&D concept so long after it was no longer considered to be 'in vogue' by the big boys.

 

MMonagle

I had your problem with issue 10. - I deduced by consultation with elsewhere on this site that the Adventurer gives you say 24 hours??? to volunteer your services to the key Hommlet NPCs (Elmo, Jaroo, Terjon) It looks as though you might only have volunteer to one, although I volunteered as a Hommlet Defender to all three.

Note: if you wait too long the Elmo dialogue reverted to normal.

After I had re-loaded back to me first meeting with the Adventurer and volunteered to Elmo immediately the WOGS proceeded normally to the repeated death of my 12th level wizard (perhaps I tried to early)

I noticed that having asked the Adventurer to join the party, he left everytime he got killed and became aggressive when raised.

Resurrection was out of the question as my only cleric was Ronny* - I assume he leaves as soon as he can resurrect Mummy and Daddy

*not a mistake I will make again.


Did I attempt WOGS at too low a level or is the leveling up supposed to be like early versions of drow fights in Verbobonc (Ronny actually went up a level in one fight and then got caught 1 XP below the next level but 1 after the next WOGS fight!)

 

I have a major problem with ToEE. When using the Front End X, I wanted to choose the "disable intro cinematics" option to start the game faster. I did so, and every. single. time. I loaded the game with intro cinematics disabled, the game would freeze completely about 1 second after the main menu loads. It froze the mouse and animations on the screen completely, only the sound continued playing and I had to ctrl-alt-delete to task manager stop it, because the windows button wouldn't go to desktop. What is wrong with the disable intro cine's option?

Nitpick; I just finished killing through the gnome tunnels and fighting the white dragons. On the model changes from ice lizard to gargoyle, I love it for the Adult White dragon. It matches the portrait and is white, and on the ground. However, the models are hideous looking on the young white dragons in the cave. I would strongly request a change in the models of the young white dragons back to ice lizards, they would look a LOT more like dragons that way. (Keep the gargoyle for adult though)

Edit: Holy carp. I just left from Verbobonc and had a NEW random encounter. I fought a group of bandits led by a parody themed robin hood. What was that? It was awesome, we need more random encounters like that, they really add huge fun to the game.

 

Did you try Alt – Tab first? In my case the game freezes every now and then to the start. Music goes on but the mouse cursor is unresponsive, about the background animations I can’t say (never paid attention). So tried to go back to desktop (or maybe to Co8 forum, can’t remember) and pressed Alt – Tab, that activated the game instead of moving me back to desktop. If you are suffering from the same issue than I, it is a Microsoft thing not a ToEE, since it has happened to me with some other games too.

edit. yes I have disabled intro too.